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Are there any municipalities in the US that provide home owners the option of making a lifetime property tax payment exempting them from property tax liabilities in the future? I’d envision something like this–a property is assessed at $100,000 and the county rate is 1.5%. The owner’s annual property tax bill is thus $1,500. The county offers to waive all future property tax assessments on the property for as long as the owner remains alive and retains the property for something like ten times that annual rate of 1.5%. If the owner takes offer and pays $15,000, he never has to pay again.

Searching around, I’m unable to find any such arrangement. I’m not sure why. Reducing current budget shortfalls at the expense of the solvency of future budgets is hardly unique in the world of government finance. Third-party lenders would step in, but it’s not obvious why that be a bug rather than a feature.

I’d think it would be an attractive revenue generator for local pols concerned about this year’s budget but not budgets a decade out, though it appears I’m incorrect. Countries that don’t have property taxes essentially mandate this by levying a stamp duty on property taxes. Monaco, for example, collects 6%-7% on property transactions but does not levy property taxes, so there is international precedent for it.

 
• Category: Economics • Tags: Taxation 
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  1. Even if a city government offered that deal, nobody will take them up on it because:

    A) The smart people know that governments renege on deals all the time. In 10 years time, the new group of city councilmen can pass a law that overrides the old deal. It’s not like there’s even any pesky Constitution to deal with at that level of government.

    B) The dumb people who might believe the word of people in government wouldn’t have enough money to participate as they don’t ever save a cent.

    I like the one-time tax better, but then you may get the annual tax later in addition. For instance, certain states will offer a reduction in property taxes (the state government puts in money to the counties to offset it) in return for a 1 percentage point increase in sales tax. After 5-10 years, property tax creeps right back up to where it was. Then, because people forget, the same deal is made again. Tax ratcheting is what I call it.

    • Agree: Tusk
    • Replies: @songbird
    What I was thinking of is Prop 2 1/2 in Massachusetts.

    Seems like a pretty good idea to limit the increase in property taxes to no more than 2.5% per year. Trouble is when it gets put on a town-wide ballot, and there are enough dumb (or crazy?) people to bypass it.

    Now, of course, technically that is part of the law, but suppose it wasn't in there. All they need is 50.1% to give themselves legitimacy. Make it a vote about taxing some other guy who doesn't pay property taxes because he was rich enough to bribe his way out of them.
    , @Jim Christian

    A) The smart people know that governments renege on deals all the time.
     
    They're crooks, but there's a contract. They of course would answer nonsense, but then, the conditions. The ones I've seen up here will be a deal until the house is transferred to a new owner/primary resident, no passing the deal down to your children. The death of the deal-maker voids and taxes start being assessed all over again. But it's a contract they'd keep to, because it's not forever, beyond the current owner. If you were to turne the property rental after the deal, that of course, cancels the deal, they keep your dough. It's an incentive to keep the owner the resident. With those conditions written in, there are a couple of arrangements that have been offered up in a couple of New England towns based on demographics, it's like insurance, almost. If you're younger, the lump sum is bigger, older, less. The whole thing scrapped in the town I was in at the time because so many high-income people come into these towns with the gold-plated schools, insist on the best of everything 'for the children' (THEIR children), then vamoose as soon as the kids go off to college, escaping the tax situation they helped create, you know, for the children. Meanwhile, townies that put their kids through school twenty and thirty years before or never had children decided no one was getting a further tax break on their dime. While they're here, they pay enormous taxes on the typically huge homes they buy and they ain't getting a break on any lump sums. Their cars, too. Townies are pissed at the hit-and-run residents and their demands.
  2. The national average property tax is 1.08%. Persons generally figure that they should be able to get a better return on investment than the money that would be given to the scheme you envision. And the property tax rate is a percentage of current property value – which can’t be predicted very well into the future. Home values tend to jump. One can’t do a one-time payment of a moving value.

    Your scheme isn’t good for either side of the deal. Particularly since most people go with a 30 year mortgage. The property tax is essentially just an addition to the mortgage payment.

  3. @Achmed E. Newman
    Even if a city government offered that deal, nobody will take them up on it because:

    A) The smart people know that governments renege on deals all the time. In 10 years time, the new group of city councilmen can pass a law that overrides the old deal. It's not like there's even any pesky Constitution to deal with at that level of government.

    B) The dumb people who might believe the word of people in government wouldn't have enough money to participate as they don't ever save a cent.

    I like the one-time tax better, but then you may get the annual tax later in addition. For instance, certain states will offer a reduction in property taxes (the state government puts in money to the counties to offset it) in return for a 1 percentage point increase in sales tax. After 5-10 years, property tax creeps right back up to where it was. Then, because people forget, the same deal is made again. Tax ratcheting is what I call it.

    What I was thinking of is Prop 2 1/2 in Massachusetts.

    Seems like a pretty good idea to limit the increase in property taxes to no more than 2.5% per year. Trouble is when it gets put on a town-wide ballot, and there are enough dumb (or crazy?) people to bypass it.

    Now, of course, technically that is part of the law, but suppose it wasn’t in there. All they need is 50.1% to give themselves legitimacy. Make it a vote about taxing some other guy who doesn’t pay property taxes because he was rich enough to bribe his way out of them.

    • Replies: @Kratoklastes

    All they need is 50.1% to give themselves legitimacy
     
    You should always point out that it's not 50%+1 of
    • the citizenry, or
    • the adult citizenry, or
    • the adult citizenry who is entitled to vote...

    Its 50%+1 of the people who vote on the issue.

    It's true that 'Proposition' type ballots are Y/N, which appears to make that less of a problem... but it isn't - because 'Abstain' is treated wrongly,

    So in a town of 100 people with a 'Proposition' ballot where people vote "Yes: 12 votes; No: 11 votes" (i.e., 77% abstentions), Yes wins when 'Abstention' is treated as NULL/None/NaN/N/A.

    An abstention should default to 'No', on the basis that 'No change' is always the ex ante cost-minimising alternative (and also: an attempt to change anything should require active support and informed consent... that is to say, a number of votes in favour that exceeds "nay" plus abstentions).

    More broadly: in most US elections, the plurality winner is the victor.

    I've got data for 'off-season' US Congressional elections by state - you would be staggered at how low turnout is when it's not a Presidential election year. Citizens know, by and large, that the choice is meaningless.

  4. Whenever I talk about net asset taxation as a replacement for income (activity) taxation, someone always chimes in with:

    “I already paid tax on my wealth!”

    What they are, in essence, saying is that the infrastructure costs of protecting property rights (ie: civilization) are “prepaid” by income taxation.

    Aside from the fact that many people have to do things like pay for trivia like not dying (you know, heat, rent, food, that kind of plebeian frivolity), I don’t think it particularly wise to advocate policies that pay in advance for services rendered by government, as we see with “The Social Security Trust Fund”. Moreover, there is no particular accounting methodology to assess the size of an annuity for the general infrastructure of civilization per income.

    Finally, these twerps need to understand the math behind the expropriation condition on a shift from economic activity tax to net asset tax.

  5. “Are there any municipalities in the US that provide home owners the option of making a lifetime property tax payment exempting them from property tax liabilities in the future?”

    LOL. like they won’t take your money, then 10 years later, say the deal is off.

  6. Only a dunderhead would take up that type of offer, because the vermin of the political class would renege on the deal the moment it became expedient to do so – relying on the fact that the costs of obtaining redress would be prohibitive.

    It’s a pretty well-established legal ‘fact'[1] that governments cannot be forced to honour their contractual obligations – operationally that’s true because it costs a poultice to get a case to court; if you take on even a local council, the legal costs can run to the hundreds of thousands for a matter of relatively low complexity… and the winning party will be out of pocket most of that amount even if they win and get awarded costs.

    Plus, if a government promise becomes more trouble than it’s worth, they can just organise a softball legal action in which the plaintiff mounts a pathetic case and loses intentionally… in order to establish a precedent (i.e., to give a BlackRobe lickspittle an opportunity to set advantageous terms for all future complaints by the peons).

    The softball decision will then live forever through vile concept of stare decisis – unless someone else is prepared to shoulder the cost of bringing another action (because they will not have standing to appeal the softball case), losing on precedent, and appealing to a higher forum.

    [1] Most legal ‘facts’ are not facts – they’re called ‘opinions’ and ‘decisions’ because that’s all they actually are.

  7. @songbird
    What I was thinking of is Prop 2 1/2 in Massachusetts.

    Seems like a pretty good idea to limit the increase in property taxes to no more than 2.5% per year. Trouble is when it gets put on a town-wide ballot, and there are enough dumb (or crazy?) people to bypass it.

    Now, of course, technically that is part of the law, but suppose it wasn't in there. All they need is 50.1% to give themselves legitimacy. Make it a vote about taxing some other guy who doesn't pay property taxes because he was rich enough to bribe his way out of them.

    All they need is 50.1% to give themselves legitimacy

    You should always point out that it’s not 50%+1 of
    • the citizenry, or
    • the adult citizenry, or
    • the adult citizenry who is entitled to vote…

    Its 50%+1 of the people who vote on the issue.

    It’s true that ‘Proposition’ type ballots are Y/N, which appears to make that less of a problem… but it isn’t – because ‘Abstain‘ is treated wrongly,

    So in a town of 100 people with a ‘Proposition’ ballot where people vote “Yes: 12 votes; No: 11 votes” (i.e., 77% abstentions), Yes wins when ‘Abstention’ is treated as NULL/None/NaN/N/A.

    An abstention should default to ‘No‘, on the basis that ‘No change’ is always the ex ante cost-minimising alternative (and also: an attempt to change anything should require active support and informed consent… that is to say, a number of votes in favour that exceeds “nay” plus abstentions).

    More broadly: in most US elections, the plurality winner is the victor.

    I’ve got data for ‘off-season’ US Congressional elections by state – you would be staggered at how low turnout is when it’s not a Presidential election year. Citizens know, by and large, that the choice is meaningless.

    • Agree: songbird
    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    I like that idea, Krato. Whether it's due to ignorance, laziness, or disgust, any non-votes from registered voters ought to be counted as against any new laws.
  8. There’s not enough in it for the government in most cases when talking about the little people. And, when there is money in it such as for big new corporate facilities, you see that they do, in fact, use property taxes as a bargaining tool all the time.

  9. What happens if you sell the home? From a federal tax standpoint, the deduction for state income and real estate taxes is limited to $10K, so even if you could do this, you’d have a lot of wasted deductions for the year in which you elected to make the lifetime payment and then going forward.

    Anyway, you’d have to be sucker to think government would honor this arrangement even if offered. They’d end up with a need for money to pay for critical ‘investments’ and either renege on property taxes or just jack them up somewhere else.

  10. @Kratoklastes

    All they need is 50.1% to give themselves legitimacy
     
    You should always point out that it's not 50%+1 of
    • the citizenry, or
    • the adult citizenry, or
    • the adult citizenry who is entitled to vote...

    Its 50%+1 of the people who vote on the issue.

    It's true that 'Proposition' type ballots are Y/N, which appears to make that less of a problem... but it isn't - because 'Abstain' is treated wrongly,

    So in a town of 100 people with a 'Proposition' ballot where people vote "Yes: 12 votes; No: 11 votes" (i.e., 77% abstentions), Yes wins when 'Abstention' is treated as NULL/None/NaN/N/A.

    An abstention should default to 'No', on the basis that 'No change' is always the ex ante cost-minimising alternative (and also: an attempt to change anything should require active support and informed consent... that is to say, a number of votes in favour that exceeds "nay" plus abstentions).

    More broadly: in most US elections, the plurality winner is the victor.

    I've got data for 'off-season' US Congressional elections by state - you would be staggered at how low turnout is when it's not a Presidential election year. Citizens know, by and large, that the choice is meaningless.

    I like that idea, Krato. Whether it’s due to ignorance, laziness, or disgust, any non-votes from registered voters ought to be counted as against any new laws.

  11. California’s property taxes work effectively the way you describe courtesy of Prop 13, which limits the maximum property tax increase to 2% per year for as long as you own the property. So, calculate your lifetime liability, put it in an interest-bearing cash instrument, and you’re set for life.

    As with all other things in life, there is always the risk of legislative change.

  12. a property is assessed at $100,000 and the county rate is 1.5%. The owner’s annual property tax bill is thus $1,500.

    Is that just an example or is that normative in other parts of the country? In Cook County it would be more like $5-10k.

  13. Property taxes exist to encourage sprawl and promote our inflationary bubble (((economy))).

    That’s one reason why no one in business or the federal state wants to do anything about them.

    • Replies: @Justvisiting
    Great video on the land tax vs property tax.

    However, the narrator is unfamiliar with the issues we raise here.

    We do not want to create incentives for development in Whitopia.

    In a high trust society his proposal makes sense--in the US, fuggedaboutit.
  14. @Achmed E. Newman
    Even if a city government offered that deal, nobody will take them up on it because:

    A) The smart people know that governments renege on deals all the time. In 10 years time, the new group of city councilmen can pass a law that overrides the old deal. It's not like there's even any pesky Constitution to deal with at that level of government.

    B) The dumb people who might believe the word of people in government wouldn't have enough money to participate as they don't ever save a cent.

    I like the one-time tax better, but then you may get the annual tax later in addition. For instance, certain states will offer a reduction in property taxes (the state government puts in money to the counties to offset it) in return for a 1 percentage point increase in sales tax. After 5-10 years, property tax creeps right back up to where it was. Then, because people forget, the same deal is made again. Tax ratcheting is what I call it.

    A) The smart people know that governments renege on deals all the time.

    They’re crooks, but there’s a contract. They of course would answer nonsense, but then, the conditions. The ones I’ve seen up here will be a deal until the house is transferred to a new owner/primary resident, no passing the deal down to your children. The death of the deal-maker voids and taxes start being assessed all over again. But it’s a contract they’d keep to, because it’s not forever, beyond the current owner. If you were to turne the property rental after the deal, that of course, cancels the deal, they keep your dough. It’s an incentive to keep the owner the resident. With those conditions written in, there are a couple of arrangements that have been offered up in a couple of New England towns based on demographics, it’s like insurance, almost. If you’re younger, the lump sum is bigger, older, less. The whole thing scrapped in the town I was in at the time because so many high-income people come into these towns with the gold-plated schools, insist on the best of everything ‘for the children’ (THEIR children), then vamoose as soon as the kids go off to college, escaping the tax situation they helped create, you know, for the children. Meanwhile, townies that put their kids through school twenty and thirty years before or never had children decided no one was getting a further tax break on their dime. While they’re here, they pay enormous taxes on the typically huge homes they buy and they ain’t getting a break on any lump sums. Their cars, too. Townies are pissed at the hit-and-run residents and their demands.

  15. @John Burns, Gettysburg Partisan
    Property taxes exist to encourage sprawl and promote our inflationary bubble (((economy))).

    That's one reason why no one in business or the federal state wants to do anything about them.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ok2uR3btMrE

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JkXEM7fgGDc

    Great video on the land tax vs property tax.

    However, the narrator is unfamiliar with the issues we raise here.

    We do not want to create incentives for development in Whitopia.

    In a high trust society his proposal makes sense–in the US, fuggedaboutit.

  16. Totally off-topic, but oh man – the optics!!!

    Peace.

    • Replies: @LoutishAngloQuebecker
    Smart response by a Groyper in the replies:

    People hate whites. They hate whote Christians the most, but even white muslims get chastised when they are literally doing nothing but being presentable.
     
    Anyways, I've noticed a large uptick in the amount of "whigger" behaviour going on in Canada with young folks. All races are now "racing" to the bottom trying to act like American blacks. Desperate for an identity, I guess. Looks miserable and phony to me. Note just the boys act like this, not women. Previously it was just the brown and Arab people but now it's white and asian kids too. Guess they're bringing us down to their level.

    Nice to see clean cut, white kids, regardless of their religion.
  17. Are there any municipalities in the US that provide home owners the option of making a lifetime property tax payment exempting them from property tax liabilities in the future?

    I think you do not understand the nature of what is called “property tax”.

    If these “home owners” really owned their home, to whom would they pay the tax?

    Fee simple is the highest from of tenant property.

    Who holds superior title? Why?

    States used to guarantee allodial title in their state constitutions.
    Why were these provisions repealed?

    Here’s an example from the New York State constitution of 1894.
    (I use New York as an example because it is easily one of the most corrupt states.)

    § 11. [Feudal tenures abolished.]-All feudal tenures of every description, with all their incidents, are declared to be abolished, saving however, all rents and services certain which at any time heretofore have been lawfully created or reserved.

    § 12. [Allodial tenures.]-All lands within this State are declared to be allodial, so that, subject only to the liability to escheat, the entire and absolute property is vested in the owners, according to the nature of their respective estates.

    https://www.nycourts.gov/history/legal-history-new-york/documents/Publications_1894-NY-Constitution.pdf

    Section 10 of the New York state constitution of 1938 provided for allodial tenure. Section 10, which dealt with ownership of lands, allodial tenures and escheats, was repealed by amendment approved by vote of the people November 6, 1962.

    Why on earth would a free people vote for feudalism?

    More importantly, why on earth were the “representatives” who voted to abolish allodial freehold in exchange for feudalism not rounded up the very next day and shot dead in the street like rabid monkeys?

    Did you agree to have your “property” pledged as collateral for the glorious war debt?

    Isn’t the “property tax” payment really just rent payment to the superior title holder? (landlord)

    In article 1 section 10 of the U.S. constitution you will find this…
    No State shall… make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts.

    How many “home owners” tendered payment with gold or silver coin?

    Could it be that you cannot “pay a debt” with a debt based instrument?

    Are these “home owners” not exercising a privilege to “discharge their debts in equity” instead of “paying their debts at law”.

    When did Americans decide to trade allodial freehold for feudal tenure?

    Do you prefer living in a feudal society?

    Interestingly, the first plank of the communist manifesto is:
    “Abolition of property in land and application of all rents of land to public purposes.”

    Have you noticed that when title to land is transfered there is a separate contract for the “property tax”? What happens if you transfer title without signing the “property tax” contract?

    Have you noticed that the person contracted to pay the “property tax” does not necessarily have to be the person who holds fee simple title?

    Also at article 1 section 10 you will find this:
    No State shall… pass any law… impairing the Obligation of Contracts.

    Maybe it is time we stop lying to ourselves and our children about living in a free society.

    Or

    Maybe it’s time we start living as free people and stop signing contracts we do not understand. (And in most cases, haven’t even read.)

    Please forgive run on comment. I find the history of the enslavement of a once free American people to be a most fascinating subject.

    • Replies: @Adam Smith

    Please forgive run on comment.
     
    Please forgive my run on comment.

    Also, it seems that Nevada and Texas both still have provisions allowing for allodial title.

    In 1997 Nevada Senate Bill 403 defined the parameters for an allodial title program for the state. This appears to be the only official allodial re-titling program in the United States.

    These statutes, which were entitled “Allodial Title”, became effective on July 1, 1998, and were intended to protect property owners from the burden of the high increases in property taxes that often occur when unincorporated land becomes part of a town or city. Nevada allowed persons who owned and lived in single family residences to obtain allodial title if the property was not mortgaged and had no tax liens. Allodial titles were subject to exemptions from seizure in debt or bankruptcy under homestead laws; however, a property could be seized if used in a criminal enterprise. In 2005, the Nevada Legislature prohibited applications by property owner for an allodial title after June 13 of that year.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allodial_title

    https://www.interstice.com/~drewes/allodial.html

    I'm under the impression that one can still exercise allodial title rights in Texas.

    You must own the land with no encumbrances. You must own the minerals and the land. (The mineral interest holder has superior title over the person who holds title to the land.) No mortgage, no divided interest.

    You must have a complete chain of title all the way back to the Land Patent issued by the state of Texas.

    The land Patent is a contract with the state of Texas, guaranteeing to "the original assignee and their heirs and assigns FOREVER all the right and title in and to said land". You will probably have to call the state archives in Austin. The lady on the phone was very nice and very helpful. Official copies of the land patent were, if I recall, like $20 each. (I helped someone do this about 8 years ago.)

    Announce your intentions to the public. Take out an ad in the newspaper for a month. Declare it allodial and give anyone else with a claim time to come forward. Post copies of your announcement on the bulletin board at the court house and post office. Make it publicly known.

    After that record it as allodial with the county and let the tax assessor know that it's been fun doing business all these years, but all good things come to an end.

    If corporations, schools, churches and other non-profits can be "tax exempt" why not humans?

    Here's what a Texas land patent looks like.

    https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth426838/m1/1/high_res/

    https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth866259/m1/1/high_res/
  18. @Adam Smith

    Are there any municipalities in the US that provide home owners the option of making a lifetime property tax payment exempting them from property tax liabilities in the future?
     
    I think you do not understand the nature of what is called "property tax".

    If these "home owners" really owned their home, to whom would they pay the tax?

    Fee simple is the highest from of tenant property.

    Who holds superior title? Why?

    States used to guarantee allodial title in their state constitutions.
    Why were these provisions repealed?

    Here's an example from the New York State constitution of 1894.
    (I use New York as an example because it is easily one of the most corrupt states.)

    § 11. [Feudal tenures abolished.]-All feudal tenures of every description, with all their incidents, are declared to be abolished, saving however, all rents and services certain which at any time heretofore have been lawfully created or reserved.

    § 12. [Allodial tenures.]-All lands within this State are declared to be allodial, so that, subject only to the liability to escheat, the entire and absolute property is vested in the owners, according to the nature of their respective estates.

    https://www.nycourts.gov/history/legal-history-new-york/documents/Publications_1894-NY-Constitution.pdf

    Section 10 of the New York state constitution of 1938 provided for allodial tenure. Section 10, which dealt with ownership of lands, allodial tenures and escheats, was repealed by amendment approved by vote of the people November 6, 1962.

    Why on earth would a free people vote for feudalism?

    More importantly, why on earth were the "representatives" who voted to abolish allodial freehold in exchange for feudalism not rounded up the very next day and shot dead in the street like rabid monkeys?

    Did you agree to have your "property" pledged as collateral for the glorious war debt?

    Isn't the "property tax" payment really just rent payment to the superior title holder? (landlord)

    In article 1 section 10 of the U.S. constitution you will find this...
    No State shall... make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts.

    How many "home owners" tendered payment with gold or silver coin?

    Could it be that you cannot "pay a debt" with a debt based instrument?

    Are these "home owners" not exercising a privilege to "discharge their debts in equity" instead of "paying their debts at law".

    When did Americans decide to trade allodial freehold for feudal tenure?

    Do you prefer living in a feudal society?

    Interestingly, the first plank of the communist manifesto is:
    "Abolition of property in land and application of all rents of land to public purposes."

    Have you noticed that when title to land is transfered there is a separate contract for the "property tax"? What happens if you transfer title without signing the "property tax" contract?

    Have you noticed that the person contracted to pay the "property tax" does not necessarily have to be the person who holds fee simple title?

    Also at article 1 section 10 you will find this:
    No State shall... pass any law... impairing the Obligation of Contracts.

    Maybe it is time we stop lying to ourselves and our children about living in a free society.

    Or

    Maybe it's time we start living as free people and stop signing contracts we do not understand. (And in most cases, haven't even read.)

    Please forgive run on comment. I find the history of the enslavement of a once free American people to be a most fascinating subject.

    Please forgive run on comment.

    Please forgive my run on comment.

    Also, it seems that Nevada and Texas both still have provisions allowing for allodial title.

    In 1997 Nevada Senate Bill 403 defined the parameters for an allodial title program for the state. This appears to be the only official allodial re-titling program in the United States.

    These statutes, which were entitled “Allodial Title”, became effective on July 1, 1998, and were intended to protect property owners from the burden of the high increases in property taxes that often occur when unincorporated land becomes part of a town or city. Nevada allowed persons who owned and lived in single family residences to obtain allodial title if the property was not mortgaged and had no tax liens. Allodial titles were subject to exemptions from seizure in debt or bankruptcy under homestead laws; however, a property could be seized if used in a criminal enterprise. In 2005, the Nevada Legislature prohibited applications by property owner for an allodial title after June 13 of that year.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allodial_title

    https://www.interstice.com/~drewes/allodial.html

    I’m under the impression that one can still exercise allodial title rights in Texas.

    You must own the land with no encumbrances. You must own the minerals and the land. (The mineral interest holder has superior title over the person who holds title to the land.) No mortgage, no divided interest.

    You must have a complete chain of title all the way back to the Land Patent issued by the state of Texas.

    The land Patent is a contract with the state of Texas, guaranteeing to “the original assignee and their heirs and assigns FOREVER all the right and title in and to said land”. You will probably have to call the state archives in Austin. The lady on the phone was very nice and very helpful. Official copies of the land patent were, if I recall, like $20 each. (I helped someone do this about 8 years ago.)

    Announce your intentions to the public. Take out an ad in the newspaper for a month. Declare it allodial and give anyone else with a claim time to come forward. Post copies of your announcement on the bulletin board at the court house and post office. Make it publicly known.

    After that record it as allodial with the county and let the tax assessor know that it’s been fun doing business all these years, but all good things come to an end.

    If corporations, schools, churches and other non-profits can be “tax exempt” why not humans?

    Here’s what a Texas land patent looks like.

    https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth426838/m1/1/high_res/

    https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth866259/m1/1/high_res/

    • Replies: @EH
    I was going to mention the Nevada allodial title experiment - hardly any owners went for it. A major reason was that forbidding such land to be seized for debts made it unmortgageable, and thus almost unsalable.
  19. @Talha
    Totally off-topic, but oh man - the optics!!!
    https://twitter.com/amalieskram/status/1203824742702223361

    Peace.

    Smart response by a Groyper in the replies:

    People hate whites. They hate whote Christians the most, but even white muslims get chastised when they are literally doing nothing but being presentable.

    Anyways, I’ve noticed a large uptick in the amount of “whigger” behaviour going on in Canada with young folks. All races are now “racing” to the bottom trying to act like American blacks. Desperate for an identity, I guess. Looks miserable and phony to me. Note just the boys act like this, not women. Previously it was just the brown and Arab people but now it’s white and asian kids too. Guess they’re bringing us down to their level.

    Nice to see clean cut, white kids, regardless of their religion.

    • Replies: @Talha

    All races are now “racing” to the bottom trying to act like American blacks. Desperate for an identity, I guess.
     
    Exactly it. People respect those that have some level of confidence.

    Looks miserable and phony to me.
     
    Yup - I remember visiting parts of South Central LA during the late 90's when I volunteered at a clinic that provided free medical care to the surroundign population - also I used to deliver our Muslim newspapers from UCLA to the various mosques in the area.

    Those guys that act "ghetto" wouldn't actually survive a single night in the real ghetto.

    Previously it was just the brown and Arab people but now it’s white and asian kids too.
     
    That's a shame - "ghetto" culture is detrimental and something that I know many Black Muslims are happy to have escaped from.

    Nice to see clean cut, white kids, regardless of their religion.
     
    Agreed - I would have preferred a little facial hair myself. I'm one of those old-school guys that's a bit wary of Islamic institute of knowledge graduating students without sporting at least short beard. That's just me though.

    Peace.
    , @Brown Boiii
    You're about a decade late to noticing this and the main reason I roast you for being out of touch & delusional.
  20. @LoutishAngloQuebecker
    Smart response by a Groyper in the replies:

    People hate whites. They hate whote Christians the most, but even white muslims get chastised when they are literally doing nothing but being presentable.
     
    Anyways, I've noticed a large uptick in the amount of "whigger" behaviour going on in Canada with young folks. All races are now "racing" to the bottom trying to act like American blacks. Desperate for an identity, I guess. Looks miserable and phony to me. Note just the boys act like this, not women. Previously it was just the brown and Arab people but now it's white and asian kids too. Guess they're bringing us down to their level.

    Nice to see clean cut, white kids, regardless of their religion.

    All races are now “racing” to the bottom trying to act like American blacks. Desperate for an identity, I guess.

    Exactly it. People respect those that have some level of confidence.

    Looks miserable and phony to me.

    Yup – I remember visiting parts of South Central LA during the late 90’s when I volunteered at a clinic that provided free medical care to the surroundign population – also I used to deliver our Muslim newspapers from UCLA to the various mosques in the area.

    Those guys that act “ghetto” wouldn’t actually survive a single night in the real ghetto.

    Previously it was just the brown and Arab people but now it’s white and asian kids too.

    That’s a shame – “ghetto” culture is detrimental and something that I know many Black Muslims are happy to have escaped from.

    Nice to see clean cut, white kids, regardless of their religion.

    Agreed – I would have preferred a little facial hair myself. I’m one of those old-school guys that’s a bit wary of Islamic institute of knowledge graduating students without sporting at least short beard. That’s just me though.

    Peace.

  21. Keep it simple.

    Consider a progressive land-tax only system (no tax on structures/improvements) with a high minimum threshold (say $5m), adjusted periodically to inflation.

    All land must be held by a natural, living person, any corporate/trust held land is taxed at the maximum effective rate.

    What would be the net result? A lot more landowners with plots under $5m, that’s what… And damn few valued over that amount.

  22. will say this,

    the state of Texas is very appreciative of its military veterans that are home owners —-

    I encourage anyone to look at the tax structure for veterans home owners in the state and add on top of that senior citizen discounts.

  23. @LoutishAngloQuebecker
    Smart response by a Groyper in the replies:

    People hate whites. They hate whote Christians the most, but even white muslims get chastised when they are literally doing nothing but being presentable.
     
    Anyways, I've noticed a large uptick in the amount of "whigger" behaviour going on in Canada with young folks. All races are now "racing" to the bottom trying to act like American blacks. Desperate for an identity, I guess. Looks miserable and phony to me. Note just the boys act like this, not women. Previously it was just the brown and Arab people but now it's white and asian kids too. Guess they're bringing us down to their level.

    Nice to see clean cut, white kids, regardless of their religion.

    You’re about a decade late to noticing this and the main reason I roast you for being out of touch & delusional.

    • Replies: @LoutishAngloQuebecker
    Nah, a decade ago it was contained in Toronto, now it's spread to every city in Ontario.

    Anyways I usually just laugh in their face, seeing a white or brown or yellow person impersonating a negro as their identity is both sad and hilarious at the same time. I know they all know better, I hope they change as they mature.

    The even sadder thing is I talk to young arabs and blacks and they don't seem to even be aware that a way exists as a normal person.
  24. @Brown Boiii
    You're about a decade late to noticing this and the main reason I roast you for being out of touch & delusional.

    Nah, a decade ago it was contained in Toronto, now it’s spread to every city in Ontario.

    Anyways I usually just laugh in their face, seeing a white or brown or yellow person impersonating a negro as their identity is both sad and hilarious at the same time. I know they all know better, I hope they change as they mature.

    The even sadder thing is I talk to young arabs and blacks and they don’t seem to even be aware that a way exists as a normal person.

    • Replies: @Brown Boiii
    True about the decade ago even Ethnic Whites & Minorities weren’t nogged back then.
    They don't see it as Negro.

    Boring richer people play black music at parties but realize they’re not tough.
    Poor people don't have the money for the gucci-prada life so they emulate thugs.
    --
    The Natives & the Maritimes are cultural canaries.
    Both were converted to ghetto culture in the mid to late 90s.
    --

    For a black/arab what is normal?
    Having multiple kids with different women, who are all massive whores, while getting government to support them is bad how??
    You’re not going to marry the chick.
    ===
    https://www.openbible.info/topics/weapons

    Funny first verse is put your sword away||
  25. @LoutishAngloQuebecker
    Nah, a decade ago it was contained in Toronto, now it's spread to every city in Ontario.

    Anyways I usually just laugh in their face, seeing a white or brown or yellow person impersonating a negro as their identity is both sad and hilarious at the same time. I know they all know better, I hope they change as they mature.

    The even sadder thing is I talk to young arabs and blacks and they don't seem to even be aware that a way exists as a normal person.

    True about the decade ago even Ethnic Whites & Minorities weren’t nogged back then.
    They don’t see it as Negro.

    Boring richer people play black music at parties but realize they’re not tough.
    Poor people don’t have the money for the gucci-prada life so they emulate thugs.

    The Natives & the Maritimes are cultural canaries.
    Both were converted to ghetto culture in the mid to late 90s.

    For a black/arab what is normal?
    Having multiple kids with different women, who are all massive whores, while getting government to support them is bad how??
    You’re not going to marry the chick.
    ===
    https://www.openbible.info/topics/weapons

    Funny first verse is put your sword away||

    • Replies: @LoutishAngloQuebecker
    Not totally sure what you're trying to say in this comment. Take it easy on the drinking lol.

    But overall we both agree, the nogging has gotten much worse in the past 5-10 years. Critically severe in the past 3.

    What religion do you recommend?
  26. @Brown Boiii
    True about the decade ago even Ethnic Whites & Minorities weren’t nogged back then.
    They don't see it as Negro.

    Boring richer people play black music at parties but realize they’re not tough.
    Poor people don't have the money for the gucci-prada life so they emulate thugs.
    --
    The Natives & the Maritimes are cultural canaries.
    Both were converted to ghetto culture in the mid to late 90s.
    --

    For a black/arab what is normal?
    Having multiple kids with different women, who are all massive whores, while getting government to support them is bad how??
    You’re not going to marry the chick.
    ===
    https://www.openbible.info/topics/weapons

    Funny first verse is put your sword away||

    Not totally sure what you’re trying to say in this comment. Take it easy on the drinking lol.

    But overall we both agree, the nogging has gotten much worse in the past 5-10 years. Critically severe in the past 3.

    What religion do you recommend?

  27. @Adam Smith

    Please forgive run on comment.
     
    Please forgive my run on comment.

    Also, it seems that Nevada and Texas both still have provisions allowing for allodial title.

    In 1997 Nevada Senate Bill 403 defined the parameters for an allodial title program for the state. This appears to be the only official allodial re-titling program in the United States.

    These statutes, which were entitled “Allodial Title”, became effective on July 1, 1998, and were intended to protect property owners from the burden of the high increases in property taxes that often occur when unincorporated land becomes part of a town or city. Nevada allowed persons who owned and lived in single family residences to obtain allodial title if the property was not mortgaged and had no tax liens. Allodial titles were subject to exemptions from seizure in debt or bankruptcy under homestead laws; however, a property could be seized if used in a criminal enterprise. In 2005, the Nevada Legislature prohibited applications by property owner for an allodial title after June 13 of that year.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allodial_title

    https://www.interstice.com/~drewes/allodial.html

    I'm under the impression that one can still exercise allodial title rights in Texas.

    You must own the land with no encumbrances. You must own the minerals and the land. (The mineral interest holder has superior title over the person who holds title to the land.) No mortgage, no divided interest.

    You must have a complete chain of title all the way back to the Land Patent issued by the state of Texas.

    The land Patent is a contract with the state of Texas, guaranteeing to "the original assignee and their heirs and assigns FOREVER all the right and title in and to said land". You will probably have to call the state archives in Austin. The lady on the phone was very nice and very helpful. Official copies of the land patent were, if I recall, like $20 each. (I helped someone do this about 8 years ago.)

    Announce your intentions to the public. Take out an ad in the newspaper for a month. Declare it allodial and give anyone else with a claim time to come forward. Post copies of your announcement on the bulletin board at the court house and post office. Make it publicly known.

    After that record it as allodial with the county and let the tax assessor know that it's been fun doing business all these years, but all good things come to an end.

    If corporations, schools, churches and other non-profits can be "tax exempt" why not humans?

    Here's what a Texas land patent looks like.

    https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth426838/m1/1/high_res/

    https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth866259/m1/1/high_res/

    I was going to mention the Nevada allodial title experiment – hardly any owners went for it. A major reason was that forbidding such land to be seized for debts made it unmortgageable, and thus almost unsalable.

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