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The two post-debate polls that have been conducted indicate as much. Combining results from CNN and Quinnipiac yields the following:

Biden — 22%
Harris — 18.5%
Warren — 14.5%
Sanders — 13.5%

Buttigieg is in a distant fifth, at 3.5%, and the rest of the field is at 3% or less. Mayor Pete was well prepared and sounded sober and sincere in his responses. He was also arguably the least explicitly Woke candidate in the field–and it looks like he doesn’t have a chance. We’re in the midst of The Great Awokening. This isn’t a time for calmly reading from the lectern, it’s a time for writhing on the floor and speaking in tongues.

Elizabeth Warren has a serious black problem. The Quinnipiac poll specifically reported on black support (the CNN poll only drilled down to “white” and “non-white”). Black support shakes out as follows:

Biden — 31%
Harris — 27%
Sanders — 16%
Booker — 5%
Warren — 4%

Expect Harris to keep courting this electorally crucial demographic. Biden’s only parry is the Obama-Biden administration’s legacy. Will Obama implicitly endorse one of them while it matters? I suspect the former president will not. That’s what eight years of loyal service gets Biden–a snub! In fairness, had Obama’s VP been someone not in the running, Harris could reasonably expect to receive Obama’s support. His residual appreciation of Biden’s service will probably cause Obama to stay mum.

Speaking of, ratings on who is perceived to be the best on the four most pressing political issues (CNN again):

If not for the evergreen subject of race relations, it’d be Biden banging on about the economy and Sanders harping on health care. Harris wouldn’t even be in the conversation. But they’re white, she’s not, and race matters–a lot. So the smart money is now on Harris.

Don’t expect us to feel sorry for you, Joe. This is the future you chose.

As an aside, the primaries will probably be at their nastiest if it comes down to Harris and Warren.

I stand by my previous assertion that Trump’s toughest potential matchup is Biden while his easiest is Warren. The percentages of voters who approve of Trump’s presidential performance while simultaneously maintaining a favorable opinion of the following Democrats (from CNN):

Biden — 22%
Sanders — 13%
Warren — 7%
Harris — 7%

By a 61%-36% margin, registered Democrats support government-provided health insurance for “undocumented immigrants”. That’s correct–most Democrats think anyone, from anywhere in the world, should be able to receive free medical care in America if he can get here.

Isn’t the humanitarian thing to do, then, to arrange charter flights to bring the global poor from every corner of the globe to an ER near you? … I really hope there aren’t any Democrat staffers reading this!

 
• Category: Culture/Society • Tags: Election 2020, Polling 
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  1. It is already absurd that the campaign has to start 24 months before the election. That was most certainly NOT what the Founding Fathers envisioned.

    • Replies: @neutral
    The Founding Fathers did not want non whites in government, women in government, homosexual marriage, miscegenation, porn seen as free speech, whites forced to pay non whites, foreign policy run by Israel, censorship outsourced to corporations, whites being ethnically cleansed, Christianity being replaced by the LGBTABC123 cult, etc.

    So being worried about when they should start their election campaigns is hardly the biggest problem here.
  2. By a 61%-36% margin, registered Democrats support government-provided health insurance for “undocumented immigrants”. That’s correct–most Democrats think anyone, from anywhere in the world, should be able to receive free medical care in America if he can get here.

    That settles it. These people are insane.

    • Replies: @Twinkie

    That settles it. These people are insane.
     
    For once, I wholeheartedly agree with you.
    , @Achmed E. Newman

    These people are insane.
     
    AGREED.
    , @reiner Tor
    Has it not conclusively been settled a long time ago?

    But I agree, if there was no other sign of it, it'd be enough to come to the conclusion.
  3. @Rosie

    By a 61%-36% margin, registered Democrats support government-provided health insurance for “undocumented immigrants”. That’s correct–most Democrats think anyone, from anywhere in the world, should be able to receive free medical care in America if he can get here.
     
    That settles it. These people are insane.

    That settles it. These people are insane.

    For once, I wholeheartedly agree with you.

  4. I stand by my previous assertion that Trump’s toughest potential matchup is Biden while his easiest is Warren.

    I agree with this. Sanders, Harris, and Warren all have potentially fatal flaws as candidates in the general election. Most American voters aren’t quite ready to embrace Sanders’ overt socialism, Harris comes off as a grievance (“black-Indian-female”) candidate who has coasted on a powerful man (of which other former – and failed – candidate does that remind you?), and Warren is a fake American Indian who got a Harvard job with affirmative action fraud.

    Biden comes off as the least offensive to the general public. Sure, he’s a creepy guy who can’t keep his hands off women and children and often says strange and borderline senile things, but he comes off as vaguely centrist and usually mild-mannered. He appears harmless enough to have a beer with at a bar. His hurdles are that he doesn’t generate excitement among the left’s base and that he is old (he missed his opportunity – should have run against Hillary and possibly against Trump the first time around).

    • Agree: Johann Ricke
    • Replies: @Justvisiting
    Biden should be easy pickings for Harris.

    She is the future, he is the past.

    She can be on the attack. He will be playing defense.

    She has no real record. He has decades of stupid comments and groping of women and girls.

    All she has to do is raise enough money to organize black primary voters.

    (The trick here is to pay "gratuities" to the local black "leaders". They will get the voters to their polls one way or the other.)

    Biden (or some other white like Sanders or Warren) will be able to win Iowa and New Hampshire, and then Harris will demolish him in the south and California, and hold her own in the upper midwestern states with large urban centers.

    Game, set, match.
    , @Truth

    Biden comes off as the least offensive to the general public. Sure, he’s a creepy guy who can’t keep his hands off women and children and often says strange and borderline senile things,
     
    Oh, is that all?
  5. Seems to me this is just infotainment, like a day at the races. It’d probably interest me only if I had some money on one of these horses, but I’m not even a gambler, so I honestly don’t give a damn who wins what. Elections will solve nothing at this point. Watching these debates, had I desired to watch the idiot plate, would have just raised my blood pressure.

    Sorry, I know this is your thing, A.E., looking at the numbers. I do know where your money would be, as you’ve already gone out on a limb for Mrs. Harris. Good luck with that prediction – it’d be like Ann Coulter picking Trump back when there were 12 contenders in ’15.

    • Replies: @SunBakedSuburb
    A.E. is correct about Kamala Harris. Once Biden loses the black vote he's toast. And Kamala has the Sabbatean cult, the Hillary people, gathering around her. She will be their front. The upside to Kamala's nomination is Stacey Abram's absence from the Democratic ticket. Biden will surely offer the failed gubernatorial candidate the VP spot if he's the nominee and she will surely take it, despite her previous comments. And no whitey in their right mind wants Abrams -- intelligent, agenda-driven, revenge-seeking -- to have executive power, especially with a cowering, doddering old white man in the Oval Office. And even the white progressives who have internalized the intersectionality scheme wouldn't be politically dumb enough to put two black women on the ticket. They'd lose the black male vote.

    President Kamala Harris a.k.a. Tanit, consort of Baal. It was in the stars.
    , @Audacious Epigone
    I think it's more than infotainment. There is a lot to be gleaned about American society in The Current Year from things like this. But I would think that, wouldn't I?
  6. @Rosie

    By a 61%-36% margin, registered Democrats support government-provided health insurance for “undocumented immigrants”. That’s correct–most Democrats think anyone, from anywhere in the world, should be able to receive free medical care in America if he can get here.
     
    That settles it. These people are insane.

    These people are insane.

    AGREED.

  7. Audie, what has happened ro you recently?
    You used to be such a logical numbers-based guy, now it seems like most of your stuff ia race-baiting and demanding reparations.

    Its a tad dissappointing from a seemingly intelligent man.

    • Replies: @Thomm
    Truth, my man!

    There have been some important comedy updates.

    1) Note that I got no less than 17 replies to a post that has been posted a fourth time :

    http://www.unz.com/pgiraldi/israels-role-in-9-11/#comment-3238635

    The first post got 36 replies, but it is more damning that the fourth posting got 17 replies. These individuals are exceptionally convinced of their narrative.

    2) Elsewhere, I have created a second song for the WN wiggers. In addition to the legendary first song, 'Little Shop of Wiggers', which you recall, I had to create an additional entry that is less dependent on American pop culture and more tied to timeless classics.

    Hence, I chose Italian libretto Opera. At the right time, I will post the new song, titled 'The Marriage of Wigger-O', from the Opera, 'The Wigger of Seville'. The marriage is of course a gay marriage, which is to be expected given the infamous proclivites of the WN demographic.

    An excerpt as a teaser : think of 'Figaro', and replace it with 'Wigger-O', to the tune of :

    "Wigger-O
    Wigger-O
    Wigger-O
    Wigger-O, Wigger-O, Wigger-O, Wigger-O, Wigger-O, Wigger-O"

    https://youtu.be/3Qy_7iEtXZM?t=69


    Heh heh heh heh

    , @Twodees Partain
    You forgot to mention that you're black. You aren't of course, but you need to harp on it lest people forget.
    , @Audacious Epigone
    I've never demanding reparations and this isn't "race-baiting", it's having an honest conversation about race.
  8. We’ve just had two reparations polls come out among Democrats

    Iowa: 42% oppose, 38% Support. Among non-whites 67% support, 21% opposed

    South Carolina: In a separate issue, 59% of South Carolina residents said they would not be in favor of reparations paid to the descendants of American slaves to make up for the harm caused by slavery. A split occurred along party lines and among racial lines: 84% of GOP followers were not in favor, while 63% of Democratic followers were in favor. Nearly three-quarters of African Americans said financial reparations should be made, while only 15% of whites agreed.

  9. @Truth
    Audie, what has happened ro you recently?
    You used to be such a logical numbers-based guy, now it seems like most of your stuff ia race-baiting and demanding reparations.

    Its a tad dissappointing from a seemingly intelligent man.

    Truth, my man!

    There have been some important comedy updates.

    1) Note that I got no less than 17 replies to a post that has been posted a fourth time :

    http://www.unz.com/pgiraldi/israels-role-in-9-11/#comment-3238635

    The first post got 36 replies, but it is more damning that the fourth posting got 17 replies. These individuals are exceptionally convinced of their narrative.

    2) Elsewhere, I have created a second song for the WN wiggers. In addition to the legendary first song, ‘Little Shop of Wiggers’, which you recall, I had to create an additional entry that is less dependent on American pop culture and more tied to timeless classics.

    Hence, I chose Italian libretto Opera. At the right time, I will post the new song, titled ‘The Marriage of Wigger-O’, from the Opera, ‘The Wigger of Seville’. The marriage is of course a gay marriage, which is to be expected given the infamous proclivites of the WN demographic.

    An excerpt as a teaser : think of ‘Figaro’, and replace it with ‘Wigger-O’, to the tune of :

    “Wigger-O
    Wigger-O
    Wigger-O
    Wigger-O, Wigger-O, Wigger-O, Wigger-O, Wigger-O, Wigger-O”

    Heh heh heh heh

    • Troll: YetAnotherAnon
    • Replies: @Twinkie

    WN wiggers
     
    I am not exactly a fan of white nationalists, to put mildly, but what is it with your obsessive, constant, ad hominem-laden, and, frankly juvenile, rant against them? They are a very small, ineffectual, and powerless fraction of the white population. Most people - including whites - are horrified by them.

    You are not exactly demonstrating a high level of intelligence by engaging that kind of a tirade.
    , @Truth
    Keep pumpin' that jab Dawg. He's bleeding, eventually the ref will stop it...
  10. I think these poll results are proof positive that both CNN and Quinnipiac are total frauds…and probably have been for quite some time.

    They exist only for the 1%, are designed by the 1%, and tell us exactly what the 1% want us to think.

    The entire country despises our establishment just as much as it despises our phony media.

    The entire country thinks the DNC debates were a complete joke, with the one exception of Tulsi Gabbard.

    I cannot imagine even one American citizen actually voting for Joe Biden today.

    These polling company’s are nothing more than bought off tools of our corrupt establishment.

    Their results are as fixed and phony as “the WMD’s in Iraq”.

    • Agree: Gordo
    • Replies: @Jay Fink
    You can not imagine one American citizen voting for Joe Biden? I can easily imagine it. He has strong appeal among older Democrats, especially compared to the other candidates.

    Even if Biden generates no passion from the Dem base I still think he has a shot. The other candidates are going to fragment each other. Bernie and Warren will split the far left vote. I also see Harris and Warren eating into each other. Another thing that works for Biden is that his 55+ supporters are the most reliable voters.

    Even if he would be the hardest to beat in the general I am pulling for Biden in the primaries. It would give me some joy and satisfaction to see the candidate liberal activists don't like and don't think has a chance to end up being the nominee.

    , @Audacious Epigone
    That it were so, my good man, that it were so.
  11. But they’re white, she’s not, and race matters–a lot. So the smart money is now on Harris.

    Biden needs, behind the scene, to get someone authentically African America to start pounding on Harris not being #ADOS and point out that she, like many other non-white recent arrivals, is free-riding on bennies and perks that rightfully belong to authentic descendants of slaves. It won’t be the first time he disparaged the Indians (dot, not feather).

    If she keeps on pounding on bussing, Uncle Joe can pound on the fact that bussing put many city black youth into suburban schools where many were beated up by roving gangs of racist white yewts, and he therefore opposed bussing because opposing it was what many black parents wanted.

    • Replies: @Justvisiting
    If Biden talks about race he is toast.

    If Biden does not talk about race he is toast.

    Bernie has already figured out what is happening--you could see it by the expression on his face during the debates when Harris was speaking. He looked like he was going to puke--because he knew that his time (and the time of all white males in the Democratic Party) had passed and Harris was going to be the nominee.

    The white leftists opened the Pandora box--and now it is time for the monsters to eat them.

    It is all over except the screaming.
  12. @Thomm
    Truth, my man!

    There have been some important comedy updates.

    1) Note that I got no less than 17 replies to a post that has been posted a fourth time :

    http://www.unz.com/pgiraldi/israels-role-in-9-11/#comment-3238635

    The first post got 36 replies, but it is more damning that the fourth posting got 17 replies. These individuals are exceptionally convinced of their narrative.

    2) Elsewhere, I have created a second song for the WN wiggers. In addition to the legendary first song, 'Little Shop of Wiggers', which you recall, I had to create an additional entry that is less dependent on American pop culture and more tied to timeless classics.

    Hence, I chose Italian libretto Opera. At the right time, I will post the new song, titled 'The Marriage of Wigger-O', from the Opera, 'The Wigger of Seville'. The marriage is of course a gay marriage, which is to be expected given the infamous proclivites of the WN demographic.

    An excerpt as a teaser : think of 'Figaro', and replace it with 'Wigger-O', to the tune of :

    "Wigger-O
    Wigger-O
    Wigger-O
    Wigger-O, Wigger-O, Wigger-O, Wigger-O, Wigger-O, Wigger-O"

    https://youtu.be/3Qy_7iEtXZM?t=69


    Heh heh heh heh

    WN wiggers

    I am not exactly a fan of white nationalists, to put mildly, but what is it with your obsessive, constant, ad hominem-laden, and, frankly juvenile, rant against them? They are a very small, ineffectual, and powerless fraction of the white population. Most people – including whites – are horrified by them.

    You are not exactly demonstrating a high level of intelligence by engaging that kind of a tirade.

    • Agree: Audacious Epigone
    • Replies: @iffen
    I think that he just enjoys provoking comments. I don't see much in the way of a political intelligence. You can see this by noting comment #1.
    , @anonymous
    Ad-hominem can contribute in conveying what one feels (e.g. contempt) about someone, more intensely. Isn't conversations all about that?

    As long as profanity is minimised, why should it not be a part of one's free speech? Of course, it is a two way street, so the one must be ready for some blowback.

    No matter what you say, perhaps you took it too personally.

    And yes, White Supremacists are degenerate lowlifes.

    , @SunBakedSuburb
    "Most people - including whites - are horrified by them."

    Not "horrified," just disappointed. If you stepped down from your cloud you might recognize that these horrifying whites are seeking survival, not supremacy.
  13. @Twinkie

    WN wiggers
     
    I am not exactly a fan of white nationalists, to put mildly, but what is it with your obsessive, constant, ad hominem-laden, and, frankly juvenile, rant against them? They are a very small, ineffectual, and powerless fraction of the white population. Most people - including whites - are horrified by them.

    You are not exactly demonstrating a high level of intelligence by engaging that kind of a tirade.

    I think that he just enjoys provoking comments. I don’t see much in the way of a political intelligence. You can see this by noting comment #1.

    • Replies: @Thomm
    False. Don't project.

    You are actually saying that a 24-month Presidential election cycle is normal, and was desired all along since the Founding. What type of clod believes that? Well, you apparently.
  14. anonymous[340] • Disclaimer says:

    “Speaking of, ratings on who is perceived to be the best on the four most pressing political issues (CNN again):”

    I’m confused. Are

    – The economy
    – Health care
    – The climate crisis
    – Race relations

    the “four most pressing political issues” according to our author, to CNN, or to both? I doubt the people outside Exceptionalia would agree. Nor should conscientious Americans.

    National politics channel, delay, and harmlessly blow off dissent. No matter who wins these meaningless elections, the Establishment wages Big War with our stolen “money.” Meanwhile, Americans bleat like sheep, fighting among themselves in the bleachers at the political puppet show.

    • Replies: @Audacious Epigone
    CNN.
  15. Let us just stop and think about what ISN’T being addressed in our debates.

    The fact that every single American,…. brown , white, black, yellow, red, pink and blue is now TWENTY TWO TRILLION DOLLARS IN HEINOUS DEBT because we were all LIED into ILLEGAL WAR.

    Where is the discussion ?

    Where is the debate ?

    Where is the demand for accountability?

    Where is the recognition that defrauding the American people into illegal war of aggression is a CRIME ?

    Where is the recognition that the wars our media lied us into have nearly exterminated the entire solvency of the United States ?

    Nothing…

    Zero…..Zilch…..

    Nada.

    The entire crop of DNC candidates are all tools and total frauds, who could give two sh#ts about the American People , our country, its solvency …..and its future.

    Shameful.

    What a disgrace .

    • Replies: @anonymous
    Thank you. (My comment to the same effect was posted a little while earlier, but remains in moderation.) Forest, trees.

    Treating politics like another sportsball contest helps sustain the Empire. The distraction is evident in some of the other comments in this thread.

    , @TomSchmidt
    At least Tulsi seems to want to stop digging this particular hole.
    , @Audacious Epigone
    Tulsi tried. Here's to her continuing to try.

    But she's elegant, composed, and pretty, yet the reaction to her is a big yawn.
  16. @Rosie

    By a 61%-36% margin, registered Democrats support government-provided health insurance for “undocumented immigrants”. That’s correct–most Democrats think anyone, from anywhere in the world, should be able to receive free medical care in America if he can get here.
     
    That settles it. These people are insane.

    Has it not conclusively been settled a long time ago?

    But I agree, if there was no other sign of it, it’d be enough to come to the conclusion.

  17. this is the gist of it imo except i’d add i think both Biden and Sanders may have slipped over the line into “too old” since 2016

    if correct then instead of Biden vs Sanders it might be Harris vs Warren

    (with the latter pair taking more or less the same ideological spots as the first)

    and looking at the numbers on that match up Warren is ahead of Harris on the first three categories (economy, health, climate) so basically old school progressive vs corporate shill larping as an identity politics progressive – which neatly mirrors the underlying ideological battle.

    on recent trends (the great awokening) you’d think this would mean a blowout for Harris but i dunno.

    • Agree: Audacious Epigone
    • Replies: @TomSchmidt
    "on recent trends (the great awokening) you’d think this would mean a blowout for Harris but i dunno."

    I don't know. Blacks form the most loyal part of the Democratic coalition, but Hispanics are larger and Asians wealthier. A campaign targeted to benefit largely blacks is going to agitate those other groups, especially if reparations are general taxation on all to benefit descendants of (hopefully American) slaves. The wealthiest subgroup in America is Indian-Americans, and Jews, another ethny that votes about 70% Democrat like Indians, are not going to want to cough up proportionally more for what they see as the sins of whites.

    Now, to win the nomination you need heavy black support: it's why Hillary absolutely crushed Sanders in the states that Democrats never win in the South. So it makes for some fascinating calculus: can Harris support reparations to win the primary, and then abandon the people who supported her to win the general?
  18. @Thomm
    It is already absurd that the campaign has to start 24 months before the election. That was most certainly NOT what the Founding Fathers envisioned.

    The Founding Fathers did not want non whites in government, women in government, homosexual marriage, miscegenation, porn seen as free speech, whites forced to pay non whites, foreign policy run by Israel, censorship outsourced to corporations, whites being ethnically cleansed, Christianity being replaced by the LGBTABC123 cult, etc.

    So being worried about when they should start their election campaigns is hardly the biggest problem here.

    • Agree: 95Theses
    • Replies: @Truth
    Well, they were all wierdo deist homosexuals, as are all men above a certain level of power, influence or riches, so this is debatable.
  19. @Twinkie

    I stand by my previous assertion that Trump’s toughest potential matchup is Biden while his easiest is Warren.
     
    I agree with this. Sanders, Harris, and Warren all have potentially fatal flaws as candidates in the general election. Most American voters aren't quite ready to embrace Sanders' overt socialism, Harris comes off as a grievance ("black-Indian-female") candidate who has coasted on a powerful man (of which other former - and failed - candidate does that remind you?), and Warren is a fake American Indian who got a Harvard job with affirmative action fraud.

    Biden comes off as the least offensive to the general public. Sure, he's a creepy guy who can't keep his hands off women and children and often says strange and borderline senile things, but he comes off as vaguely centrist and usually mild-mannered. He appears harmless enough to have a beer with at a bar. His hurdles are that he doesn't generate excitement among the left's base and that he is old (he missed his opportunity - should have run against Hillary and possibly against Trump the first time around).

    Biden should be easy pickings for Harris.

    She is the future, he is the past.

    She can be on the attack. He will be playing defense.

    She has no real record. He has decades of stupid comments and groping of women and girls.

    All she has to do is raise enough money to organize black primary voters.

    (The trick here is to pay “gratuities” to the local black “leaders”. They will get the voters to their polls one way or the other.)

    Biden (or some other white like Sanders or Warren) will be able to win Iowa and New Hampshire, and then Harris will demolish him in the south and California, and hold her own in the upper midwestern states with large urban centers.

    Game, set, match.

  20. @The Alarmist

    But they’re white, she’s not, and race matters–a lot. So the smart money is now on Harris.
     
    Biden needs, behind the scene, to get someone authentically African America to start pounding on Harris not being #ADOS and point out that she, like many other non-white recent arrivals, is free-riding on bennies and perks that rightfully belong to authentic descendants of slaves. It won't be the first time he disparaged the Indians (dot, not feather).

    If she keeps on pounding on bussing, Uncle Joe can pound on the fact that bussing put many city black youth into suburban schools where many were beated up by roving gangs of racist white yewts, and he therefore opposed bussing because opposing it was what many black parents wanted.

    If Biden talks about race he is toast.

    If Biden does not talk about race he is toast.

    Bernie has already figured out what is happening–you could see it by the expression on his face during the debates when Harris was speaking. He looked like he was going to puke–because he knew that his time (and the time of all white males in the Democratic Party) had passed and Harris was going to be the nominee.

    The white leftists opened the Pandora box–and now it is time for the monsters to eat them.

    It is all over except the screaming.

    • Replies: @TomSchmidt
    "The white leftists opened the Pandora box–and now it is time for the monsters to eat them."

    Schadenfreude remains the greatest German contribution to world culture.
  21. I agree – Biden can grab the independent working class whites that ran away from Hilary, while Warren cannot. Warren is very popular with politically active whites who are over represented in the chattering classes but who are in no way representative of the larger Democratic coalition. Harris is potentially dangerous to Trump, but in an effort to gain traction in the primary she’s all in on busing and appears to be the same way on reparations, positions that will bite her if she makes it to the general. While I think she can probably mix it up in debates with Trump, it seems to me she is weak on the trail.

    • Agree: Audacious Epigone
  22. anonymous[290] • Disclaimer says:
    @Twinkie

    WN wiggers
     
    I am not exactly a fan of white nationalists, to put mildly, but what is it with your obsessive, constant, ad hominem-laden, and, frankly juvenile, rant against them? They are a very small, ineffectual, and powerless fraction of the white population. Most people - including whites - are horrified by them.

    You are not exactly demonstrating a high level of intelligence by engaging that kind of a tirade.

    Ad-hominem can contribute in conveying what one feels (e.g. contempt) about someone, more intensely. Isn’t conversations all about that?

    As long as profanity is minimised, why should it not be a part of one’s free speech? Of course, it is a two way street, so the one must be ready for some blowback.

    No matter what you say, perhaps you took it too personally.

    And yes, White Supremacists are degenerate lowlifes.

    • Replies: @anonymous

    WN wiggers
     
    Definition of "wiggers";

    a white person who tries to emulate or acquire cultural behaviour and tastes attributed to black people.
     
    On the face of it this "slur" seems quite oxymoronic. Are there truly any white nationalists who wish to emulate black people? That sounds absurd.

    It may be tempting to use them together as a counter to the other infamous slur, but is it being used with a good understanding of the definition?

    That doesn't appear to be clear.
  23. anonymous[340] • Disclaimer says:
    @alexander
    Let us just stop and think about what ISN'T being addressed in our debates.


    The fact that every single American,.... brown , white, black, yellow, red, pink and blue is now TWENTY TWO TRILLION DOLLARS IN HEINOUS DEBT because we were all LIED into ILLEGAL WAR.

    Where is the discussion ?

    Where is the debate ?

    Where is the demand for accountability?

    Where is the recognition that defrauding the American people into illegal war of aggression is a CRIME ?

    Where is the recognition that the wars our media lied us into have nearly exterminated the entire solvency of the United States ?


    Nothing...

    Zero.....Zilch.....

    Nada.


    The entire crop of DNC candidates are all tools and total frauds, who could give two sh#ts about the American People , our country, its solvency .....and its future.

    Shameful.


    What a disgrace .

    Thank you. (My comment to the same effect was posted a little while earlier, but remains in moderation.) Forest, trees.

    Treating politics like another sportsball contest helps sustain the Empire. The distraction is evident in some of the other comments in this thread.

  24. anonymous[290] • Disclaimer says:
    @anonymous
    Ad-hominem can contribute in conveying what one feels (e.g. contempt) about someone, more intensely. Isn't conversations all about that?

    As long as profanity is minimised, why should it not be a part of one's free speech? Of course, it is a two way street, so the one must be ready for some blowback.

    No matter what you say, perhaps you took it too personally.

    And yes, White Supremacists are degenerate lowlifes.

    WN wiggers

    Definition of “wiggers”;

    a white person who tries to emulate or acquire cultural behaviour and tastes attributed to black people.

    On the face of it this “slur” seems quite oxymoronic. Are there truly any white nationalists who wish to emulate black people? That sounds absurd.

    It may be tempting to use them together as a counter to the other infamous slur, but is it being used with a good understanding of the definition?

    That doesn’t appear to be clear.

  25. Usually you note the totals without them it hard to guage just how viable the results. Maybe I missed them in the read. I think the party has a very serious credibility deficit. And one that deeply effects most democrats.

    The leadership may want to pretend that where they spent their energy over the last five four years including before the camaigns officially got rolling. But among traditional democrats, I think it has lasting impact.

  26. Sid says:

    Buttigieg is definitely the SWPL candidate of choice. Well educated, highly literate, and he appears to be a respectable gay man married to a husband, and not a creepy degenerate.

    So that means he has no shot.

    Biden could beat Trump, probably quite easily, if he could skip the primaries and face Trump. But as I’ve said elsewhere, he has to answer for his erstwhile friendliness with Dixiecrats, and he’ll have to make lots of Woke statements which will dampen his appeal to WWC voters.

    Harris and Warren will have the hardest time poaching Trump voters. That said, who has the best chance of winning in 2020 between them is debatable. Harris will galvanize the black vote, but there’s nothing about her appealing to any category of white voters in particular. Warren won’t garner much black enthusiasm. On the other hand, I have to admit that while I object to her character and most of her policies, I can’t deny her statements against the plutocracy are appealing and may peel off much of the WWC.

    It’ll be interesting to see if Biden and Harris split the black vote. If so, Buttigieg, Bernie, and Warren have a shot if white liberals rally around one of them. Of course, showing any sort of preference for white Americans is anathema to what it means to be a Democrat nowadays, so I doubt the contradiction could hold!

    • Replies: @neutral
    What about the other races, who will the appeal the most to Mexicans, East Asians, Indians and MENA people?
    , @Audacious Epigone
    Biden, who was never particularly adroit when he was younger and is even more flat-footed now, isn't going to be able to thread the racial needle. He'll end up bloodying his hands up beyond recognition, I think.
    , @Truth
    Buttigieg is definitely the SWPL candidate of choice. Well educated, highly literate, and he appears to be a respectable gay man married to a husband, and not a creepy degenerate.

    Wow, I guess I'm really not in 1993 anymore.
  27. @Sid
    Buttigieg is definitely the SWPL candidate of choice. Well educated, highly literate, and he appears to be a respectable gay man married to a husband, and not a creepy degenerate.

    So that means he has no shot.

    Biden could beat Trump, probably quite easily, if he could skip the primaries and face Trump. But as I've said elsewhere, he has to answer for his erstwhile friendliness with Dixiecrats, and he'll have to make lots of Woke statements which will dampen his appeal to WWC voters.

    Harris and Warren will have the hardest time poaching Trump voters. That said, who has the best chance of winning in 2020 between them is debatable. Harris will galvanize the black vote, but there's nothing about her appealing to any category of white voters in particular. Warren won't garner much black enthusiasm. On the other hand, I have to admit that while I object to her character and most of her policies, I can't deny her statements against the plutocracy are appealing and may peel off much of the WWC.

    ---

    It'll be interesting to see if Biden and Harris split the black vote. If so, Buttigieg, Bernie, and Warren have a shot if white liberals rally around one of them. Of course, showing any sort of preference for white Americans is anathema to what it means to be a Democrat nowadays, so I doubt the contradiction could hold!

    What about the other races, who will the appeal the most to Mexicans, East Asians, Indians and MENA people?

    • Replies: @Sid
    Good question. From what I've seen and read, Hispanic voters aren't quite the lemmings blacks are.

    If blacks voted 90-95 for Hillary over Bernie, Hispanics went 60-65 for her.

    My own view is that we're starting to see an Arctic Peoples Alliance between white and East Asian men. Asian women, however, are just as woke as white women. Furthermore, East Asian women are even bigger lemmings than white women. White female liberals can BS as to "why" they believe something, whereas Asian women don't bother. The ones I've talked to believe they're supposed to be woke and hate white nationalism, because racism is bad or something!

    South Asians are at least as obnoxiously SJW as (((you know who.))) Jews largely went for Hillary over Bernie in my recollection, but I could be proven wrong, and I expect it was the same with South Asians.

    Broadly speaking, Bernie was the SWPL candidate in 2016. Most whites supported him. Most non-whites supported Hillary, with blacks almost monolithically backing her, other non-whites somewhat less so.

    My tentative prediction is: SWPLs will have to choose between Buttigieg, Warren, or Bernie this time, and then vote for him/her en masse like they live in Saddam Hussein's Iraq if they want their voice to win out this time. I doubt they will, however.

    Non-whites will choose between Biden and Harris. How they will choose, I'm not sure. For example, I'm interested in seeing if the black vote gets behind one candidate or is split between them. Biden's great advantage is his WWC touch with his woke credibility for having worked beside Obama, but his disadvantage is that he was friendly with Dixiecrats, for which Kamala Harris will attack him.

    Harris has the strengths and weaknesses of Hillary, only she's browner, younger, and dumber.
  28. @Justvisiting
    If Biden talks about race he is toast.

    If Biden does not talk about race he is toast.

    Bernie has already figured out what is happening--you could see it by the expression on his face during the debates when Harris was speaking. He looked like he was going to puke--because he knew that his time (and the time of all white males in the Democratic Party) had passed and Harris was going to be the nominee.

    The white leftists opened the Pandora box--and now it is time for the monsters to eat them.

    It is all over except the screaming.

    “The white leftists opened the Pandora box–and now it is time for the monsters to eat them.”

    Schadenfreude remains the greatest German contribution to world culture.

    • Replies: @The Alarmist
    It certainly was not Falco, Freud, & Schwartzenegger, FFS !
  29. @alexander
    Let us just stop and think about what ISN'T being addressed in our debates.


    The fact that every single American,.... brown , white, black, yellow, red, pink and blue is now TWENTY TWO TRILLION DOLLARS IN HEINOUS DEBT because we were all LIED into ILLEGAL WAR.

    Where is the discussion ?

    Where is the debate ?

    Where is the demand for accountability?

    Where is the recognition that defrauding the American people into illegal war of aggression is a CRIME ?

    Where is the recognition that the wars our media lied us into have nearly exterminated the entire solvency of the United States ?


    Nothing...

    Zero.....Zilch.....

    Nada.


    The entire crop of DNC candidates are all tools and total frauds, who could give two sh#ts about the American People , our country, its solvency .....and its future.

    Shameful.


    What a disgrace .

    At least Tulsi seems to want to stop digging this particular hole.

    • Replies: @alexander
    Yes,

    Tulsi is without doubt, the exception.
    , @Truth
    I want to climb to the roof of a 6 story building, jump off, flap my arms and fly... and I think my chances are superior than those of some puppet halting the military industrial complex from causing catastrophic damage to our "enemies."
  30. @notanon
    this is the gist of it imo except i'd add i think both Biden and Sanders may have slipped over the line into "too old" since 2016

    if correct then instead of Biden vs Sanders it might be Harris vs Warren

    (with the latter pair taking more or less the same ideological spots as the first)

    and looking at the numbers on that match up Warren is ahead of Harris on the first three categories (economy, health, climate) so basically old school progressive vs corporate shill larping as an identity politics progressive - which neatly mirrors the underlying ideological battle.

    on recent trends (the great awokening) you'd think this would mean a blowout for Harris but i dunno.

    “on recent trends (the great awokening) you’d think this would mean a blowout for Harris but i dunno.”

    I don’t know. Blacks form the most loyal part of the Democratic coalition, but Hispanics are larger and Asians wealthier. A campaign targeted to benefit largely blacks is going to agitate those other groups, especially if reparations are general taxation on all to benefit descendants of (hopefully American) slaves. The wealthiest subgroup in America is Indian-Americans, and Jews, another ethny that votes about 70% Democrat like Indians, are not going to want to cough up proportionally more for what they see as the sins of whites.

    Now, to win the nomination you need heavy black support: it’s why Hillary absolutely crushed Sanders in the states that Democrats never win in the South. So it makes for some fascinating calculus: can Harris support reparations to win the primary, and then abandon the people who supported her to win the general?

    • Agree: notanon
    • Replies: @Aft

    So it makes for some fascinating calculus: can Harris support reparations to win the primary, and then abandon the people who supported her to win the general?
     
    Can a politician who seems pretty slick do what every politician ever does? Probably. Congress would never enact it so it's a moot point anyway.
  31. AE: The Atlantic is blaming marriage (!) for the isolation and loneliness of modern life.

    https://amp.theatlantic.com/amp/article/591973/

    The hair of the dog that bitcha!

    • Replies: @Arclight
    Yeah, let's check in with groups that have largely abandoned marriage and see how that's working out for them and their kids...
    , @95Theses
    Well, of course. That’s because marriage is the main cause of divorce in America.
    , @Audacious Epigone
    Remember when they said same-sex marriage would, if anything, strengthen the institution of marriage? Ha!
  32. @TomSchmidt
    At least Tulsi seems to want to stop digging this particular hole.

    Yes,

    Tulsi is without doubt, the exception.

  33. @Rosie
    AE: The Atlantic is blaming marriage (!) for the isolation and loneliness of modern life.

    https://amp.theatlantic.com/amp/article/591973/


    The hair of the dog that bitcha!

    Yeah, let’s check in with groups that have largely abandoned marriage and see how that’s working out for them and their kids…

  34. @Truth
    Audie, what has happened ro you recently?
    You used to be such a logical numbers-based guy, now it seems like most of your stuff ia race-baiting and demanding reparations.

    Its a tad dissappointing from a seemingly intelligent man.

    You forgot to mention that you’re black. You aren’t of course, but you need to harp on it lest people forget.

    • Replies: @Talha
    I'm gonna harp on it right now!
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZHwGnGrm_k

    Peace.
    , @Truth
    "Loookie...lookie...lookie...lookie..."

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=arbGBG0BsTg
  35. @iffen
    I think that he just enjoys provoking comments. I don't see much in the way of a political intelligence. You can see this by noting comment #1.

    False. Don’t project.

    You are actually saying that a 24-month Presidential election cycle is normal, and was desired all along since the Founding. What type of clod believes that? Well, you apparently.

  36. @Rosie
    AE: The Atlantic is blaming marriage (!) for the isolation and loneliness of modern life.

    https://amp.theatlantic.com/amp/article/591973/


    The hair of the dog that bitcha!

    Well, of course. That’s because marriage is the main cause of divorce in America.

  37. Aft says:
    @TomSchmidt
    "on recent trends (the great awokening) you’d think this would mean a blowout for Harris but i dunno."

    I don't know. Blacks form the most loyal part of the Democratic coalition, but Hispanics are larger and Asians wealthier. A campaign targeted to benefit largely blacks is going to agitate those other groups, especially if reparations are general taxation on all to benefit descendants of (hopefully American) slaves. The wealthiest subgroup in America is Indian-Americans, and Jews, another ethny that votes about 70% Democrat like Indians, are not going to want to cough up proportionally more for what they see as the sins of whites.

    Now, to win the nomination you need heavy black support: it's why Hillary absolutely crushed Sanders in the states that Democrats never win in the South. So it makes for some fascinating calculus: can Harris support reparations to win the primary, and then abandon the people who supported her to win the general?

    So it makes for some fascinating calculus: can Harris support reparations to win the primary, and then abandon the people who supported her to win the general?

    Can a politician who seems pretty slick do what every politician ever does? Probably. Congress would never enact it so it’s a moot point anyway.

    • Replies: @TomSchmidt
    I'm sure when Barack Obama opposed gay marriage in 2008 he thought the same thing: Congress will never enact it. Of course, it WAS enacted, which points to how reparations will come about.

    Blacks never faulted Obama for the utter collapse in black wealth over the 2009-2014 period, so it's reasonable to assume they won't hold Harris accountable for failing to directly deliver reparations.

    There's still no such thing as too cynical.
    , @Audacious Epigone
    "never" is a long time.
  38. Aft says:

    So we get the candidate 6% think is best for the economy….on the idea electing her and giving race-based handouts (in addition to the 2:1 margin by which blacks use welfare and all other programs more) will improve race relations.

    What about LBQTIABCD where are their reparations for past mistreatment? Anyone suffer on their way sneaking into the country? Liberals with brain trauma from Trump?

    Any handout to 14% of the population is not good for relations among some other lower IQ, lower achieving groups one would think, and definitely not for relations as perceived by whites–in short, she’s the winning candidate on the issue that she’ll make America much worse on.

    • Replies: @Audacious Epigone
    Presumably the best person for "race relations" would be an accommodating, affable non-white who talked about bringing people together as Americans. That's what Obama did in 2004. That it was a presumably a grift doesn't matter--it was what America wanted to hear then. Fifteen years later, the high priestesses of Wokeness demand something much less... pacific.
  39. Aft says:
    3308166

    Intra-white variance is very high (brains, looks, talent, character), and the least desirable traits concentrate in specific carriers. No other race possesses this distributive feature.

    Literally zero evidence for this claim. Normal distribution just like any other.

    It’s far more of a thing in caste-based societies (India) or places with geographically varying admixture (e.g. Southern Thailand might as well be Malay, while Bangkok and surrounding are basically half-Chinese, with the matching 15-20 point regional IQ gaps). White Americans just don’t have these properties.

  40. Not entirely OT, but has anyone had a chance to see the latest Air Force recruitment YouTube video? Nauseating.

    Voiceover narration begins thusly, “Every superhero has an origin story.”

    • Replies: @Talha
    I know it may seem weird coming from someone like me, but I think females should be given a chance to become combat pilots if they can pass on exactly all the standards males have to without any watering down or special treatment.

    This definitely should not be encouraged in the culture (as the commercial is attempting to do), but I think it should be open to those few females that actually have that drive on their own and meet requirements. Just my take.

    Peace.
    , @Audacious Epigone
    Ask those women what their childrens' origins stories will be!

    Instead of having a family of their own, we send our nubile women to drop bombs on Yemeni families that don't even have electricity or running water.

    We have really lost our way.
  41. @TomSchmidt
    "The white leftists opened the Pandora box–and now it is time for the monsters to eat them."

    Schadenfreude remains the greatest German contribution to world culture.

    It certainly was not Falco, Freud, & Schwartzenegger, FFS !

  42. Those guys were all Austrian, in any case.

  43. @Aft

    So it makes for some fascinating calculus: can Harris support reparations to win the primary, and then abandon the people who supported her to win the general?
     
    Can a politician who seems pretty slick do what every politician ever does? Probably. Congress would never enact it so it's a moot point anyway.

    I’m sure when Barack Obama opposed gay marriage in 2008 he thought the same thing: Congress will never enact it. Of course, it WAS enacted, which points to how reparations will come about.

    Blacks never faulted Obama for the utter collapse in black wealth over the 2009-2014 period, so it’s reasonable to assume they won’t hold Harris accountable for failing to directly deliver reparations.

    There’s still no such thing as too cynical.

    • Replies: @Truth

    I’m sure when Barack Obama opposed gay marriage in 2008 he thought the same thing: Congress will never enact it. Of course, it WAS enacted, which points to how reparations will come about.
     
    These plans are made 50 years in advance, Old Sport, and the Puppet in command knows about them well before he takes office.
  44. Sid says:
    @neutral
    What about the other races, who will the appeal the most to Mexicans, East Asians, Indians and MENA people?

    Good question. From what I’ve seen and read, Hispanic voters aren’t quite the lemmings blacks are.

    If blacks voted 90-95 for Hillary over Bernie, Hispanics went 60-65 for her.

    My own view is that we’re starting to see an Arctic Peoples Alliance between white and East Asian men. Asian women, however, are just as woke as white women. Furthermore, East Asian women are even bigger lemmings than white women. White female liberals can BS as to “why” they believe something, whereas Asian women don’t bother. The ones I’ve talked to believe they’re supposed to be woke and hate white nationalism, because racism is bad or something!

    South Asians are at least as obnoxiously SJW as (((you know who.))) Jews largely went for Hillary over Bernie in my recollection, but I could be proven wrong, and I expect it was the same with South Asians.

    Broadly speaking, Bernie was the SWPL candidate in 2016. Most whites supported him. Most non-whites supported Hillary, with blacks almost monolithically backing her, other non-whites somewhat less so.

    My tentative prediction is: SWPLs will have to choose between Buttigieg, Warren, or Bernie this time, and then vote for him/her en masse like they live in Saddam Hussein’s Iraq if they want their voice to win out this time. I doubt they will, however.

    Non-whites will choose between Biden and Harris. How they will choose, I’m not sure. For example, I’m interested in seeing if the black vote gets behind one candidate or is split between them. Biden’s great advantage is his WWC touch with his woke credibility for having worked beside Obama, but his disadvantage is that he was friendly with Dixiecrats, for which Kamala Harris will attack him.

    Harris has the strengths and weaknesses of Hillary, only she’s browner, younger, and dumber.

  45. @alexander
    I think these poll results are proof positive that both CNN and Quinnipiac are total frauds...and probably have been for quite some time.

    They exist only for the 1%, are designed by the 1%, and tell us exactly what the 1% want us to think.

    The entire country despises our establishment just as much as it despises our phony media.

    The entire country thinks the DNC debates were a complete joke, with the one exception of Tulsi Gabbard.

    I cannot imagine even one American citizen actually voting for Joe Biden today.

    These polling company's are nothing more than bought off tools of our corrupt establishment.

    Their results are as fixed and phony as "the WMD's in Iraq".

    You can not imagine one American citizen voting for Joe Biden? I can easily imagine it. He has strong appeal among older Democrats, especially compared to the other candidates.

    Even if Biden generates no passion from the Dem base I still think he has a shot. The other candidates are going to fragment each other. Bernie and Warren will split the far left vote. I also see Harris and Warren eating into each other. Another thing that works for Biden is that his 55+ supporters are the most reliable voters.

    Even if he would be the hardest to beat in the general I am pulling for Biden in the primaries. It would give me some joy and satisfaction to see the candidate liberal activists don’t like and don’t think has a chance to end up being the nominee.

  46. @Achmed E. Newman
    Seems to me this is just infotainment, like a day at the races. It'd probably interest me only if I had some money on one of these horses, but I'm not even a gambler, so I honestly don't give a damn who wins what. Elections will solve nothing at this point. Watching these debates, had I desired to watch the idiot plate, would have just raised my blood pressure.

    Sorry, I know this is your thing, A.E., looking at the numbers. I do know where your money would be, as you've already gone out on a limb for Mrs. Harris. Good luck with that prediction - it'd be like Ann Coulter picking Trump back when there were 12 contenders in '15.

    A.E. is correct about Kamala Harris. Once Biden loses the black vote he’s toast. And Kamala has the Sabbatean cult, the Hillary people, gathering around her. She will be their front. The upside to Kamala’s nomination is Stacey Abram’s absence from the Democratic ticket. Biden will surely offer the failed gubernatorial candidate the VP spot if he’s the nominee and she will surely take it, despite her previous comments. And no whitey in their right mind wants Abrams — intelligent, agenda-driven, revenge-seeking — to have executive power, especially with a cowering, doddering old white man in the Oval Office. And even the white progressives who have internalized the intersectionality scheme wouldn’t be politically dumb enough to put two black women on the ticket. They’d lose the black male vote.

    President Kamala Harris a.k.a. Tanit, consort of Baal. It was in the stars.

  47. 3308166

    They are just moochers.

    They are fellow Americans who feel alienated and marginalized. The correct solution is to address their concerns and, where there is common interest (and there is), achieve the goals of those shared interests. A healthy, strong America wouldn’t produce many white nationalists. White nationalism is a symptom of our nation’s current malaise, it is neither the cause nor a solution.

    Plus, there is also the HBD angle that I have described at length before. Intra-white variance is very high (brains, looks, talent, character), and the least desirable traits concentrate in specific carriers. No other race possesses this distributive feature. This is a mechanism created by nature for efficient removal of waste matter, which keeps the other 80% of whites tip-top.

    This is complete nonsense. You are as scientifically misinformed as the people whom you purport to disparage.

    • Replies: @Thomm

    They are fellow Americans who feel alienated and marginalized.
     
    False. Some people are wired to be shameless moochers (even if they happen to be US citizens).

    Is this what you think about the most extreme 'feminists' as well?

    This is complete nonsense.

    No, it is completely sound, and easily observable.

    About 40% of WNs now openly say that they would rather have sex with a white man than a black woman, if those are the two choices available. Their rationale is that race loyalty trumps sexual orientation. That way lies madness.

    Plus, if you have noticed, the Trashionalist subculture has almost no women in it. Where, then, is the equivalent female population, comprised of similarly bottom-tier, twisted, grotesque, socialist individuals? The fat bluehaired feminists are where the women of this subrace are to be found.

    , @MikeatMikedotMike
    "White nationalism is a symptom of our nation’s current malaise, it is neither the cause nor a solution."

    So called white nationalism is a symptom of an ever increasing non white population infesting the United States, making demands for access to whites' wealth and or power and or communities.

    If the non white population of the US were under 10%, there would be no white nationalism, because it wouldn't be necessary.


    But no - you think what America needs is a few million more east Asians to build "high trust", Tahla thinks the US needs a few million more muslim Pakistanis, and Thomm thinks the US needs a few million more of his closest H1V Hindu 1st cousins, and Truth want a few trillion more dollars to facilitate all the kids he fathered that he doesn't know about, while cucks like iffen and Feryl look forward to handing their daughters over to any of them.

    And then you want to slander whites as "white nationalists" (read: racist) for daring to notice the walls closing in on the people who built the country to begin with.
    , @iffen
    You nailed it, Twinkie. Now let this ignorant dipwad fade.
    , @Truth



    They are fellow Americans who feel alienated and marginalized.
    The correct solution is to address their concerns and, where there is common interest (and there is), achieve the goals of those shared interests.
     
    Wow! you know, I agree with you Twinx, and I feel that there are other groups who fit this description, although I can't think of whom they are right now...
  48. @95Theses
    Not entirely OT, but has anyone had a chance to see the latest Air Force recruitment YouTube video? Nauseating.

    Voiceover narration begins thusly, “Every superhero has an origin story.”

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y-WElLXQfcA

    I know it may seem weird coming from someone like me, but I think females should be given a chance to become combat pilots if they can pass on exactly all the standards males have to without any watering down or special treatment.

    This definitely should not be encouraged in the culture (as the commercial is attempting to do), but I think it should be open to those few females that actually have that drive on their own and meet requirements. Just my take.

    Peace.

  49. @Twodees Partain
    You forgot to mention that you're black. You aren't of course, but you need to harp on it lest people forget.

    I’m gonna harp on it right now!

    Peace.

  50. Trump can’t run on immigration either, he allowed the open border wing of the GOP to win. Attentive voters will sit 2020 out. It will be a battle over nothing practical between a few donors and their legion of team-sport political pawns.

  51. @Twinkie

    They are just moochers.
     
    They are fellow Americans who feel alienated and marginalized. The correct solution is to address their concerns and, where there is common interest (and there is), achieve the goals of those shared interests. A healthy, strong America wouldn’t produce many white nationalists. White nationalism is a symptom of our nation’s current malaise, it is neither the cause nor a solution.

    Plus, there is also the HBD angle that I have described at length before. Intra-white variance is very high (brains, looks, talent, character), and the least desirable traits concentrate in specific carriers. No other race possesses this distributive feature. This is a mechanism created by nature for efficient removal of waste matter, which keeps the other 80% of whites tip-top.
     
    This is complete nonsense. You are as scientifically misinformed as the people whom you purport to disparage.

    They are fellow Americans who feel alienated and marginalized.

    False. Some people are wired to be shameless moochers (even if they happen to be US citizens).

    Is this what you think about the most extreme ‘feminists’ as well?

    This is complete nonsense.

    No, it is completely sound, and easily observable.

    About 40% of WNs now openly say that they would rather have sex with a white man than a black woman, if those are the two choices available. Their rationale is that race loyalty trumps sexual orientation. That way lies madness.

    Plus, if you have noticed, the Trashionalist subculture has almost no women in it. Where, then, is the equivalent female population, comprised of similarly bottom-tier, twisted, grotesque, socialist individuals? The fat bluehaired feminists are where the women of this subrace are to be found.

    • Replies: @SunBakedSuburb
    "... the Trashionalist subculture has almost no women in it."

    Neither does yours.
  52. @Twinkie

    WN wiggers
     
    I am not exactly a fan of white nationalists, to put mildly, but what is it with your obsessive, constant, ad hominem-laden, and, frankly juvenile, rant against them? They are a very small, ineffectual, and powerless fraction of the white population. Most people - including whites - are horrified by them.

    You are not exactly demonstrating a high level of intelligence by engaging that kind of a tirade.

    “Most people – including whites – are horrified by them.”

    Not “horrified,” just disappointed. If you stepped down from your cloud you might recognize that these horrifying whites are seeking survival, not supremacy.

    • Agree: Mr. Rational
    • Replies: @Feryl
    It isn't "ethnic groups" who want supremacy, but rather, it's empires who have so much hubris. Hitler claimed that all great European empires were led by "Aryans", whose greatness was only inhibited by traitors and non-Aryans. So empire builders often use (sometimes dubious) racial claims to further the cause of empire building; according to Hitler, all "Aryans" deserved to be the rulers of the world.

    The much talked about (in these parts) Anglo-Zionist alliance since the late 1940's is quite obviously "supremacist" in it's attempts to make the world revolve around Tel Aviv, London, and New York.

    The irony is that "white supremacist" Trump and his isolationist base merely want to have a world in which nobody is dominant, and we leave each other alone. Of course, the current variety of arrogant globalists (the Anglo-Zionists) makes the quite valid claim that an ideological retreat from world domination would create a vaccuum filled by someone other than the Anglo-Zionists; however, their claim that such people are inherently more "evil" or "illiberal" than the Anglo-Zionists is decidedly narcissistic and vapid, given that all empires beyond a certain point must commit a variety of abuses and betrayals in order to uphold their power and reach (or at least attempt such w/o necessarily succeeding).

    We also see the irony that modern globalists are trying to paint Western countries as oppressive police states which hate minorities and immigrants, while virtually nothing is said about misguided wars that kill tons of people needlessly (including native white Westerners).
  53. @Thomm

    They are fellow Americans who feel alienated and marginalized.
     
    False. Some people are wired to be shameless moochers (even if they happen to be US citizens).

    Is this what you think about the most extreme 'feminists' as well?

    This is complete nonsense.

    No, it is completely sound, and easily observable.

    About 40% of WNs now openly say that they would rather have sex with a white man than a black woman, if those are the two choices available. Their rationale is that race loyalty trumps sexual orientation. That way lies madness.

    Plus, if you have noticed, the Trashionalist subculture has almost no women in it. Where, then, is the equivalent female population, comprised of similarly bottom-tier, twisted, grotesque, socialist individuals? The fat bluehaired feminists are where the women of this subrace are to be found.

    “… the Trashionalist subculture has almost no women in it.”

    Neither does yours.

  54. 3308166

    They want a form of intra-white socialism that requires successful whites (like me) to subsidize them.

    Thumm, we’ve been over this. Road-pooping sub-continentals are not white. Its commendable that you don’t want to join the “flight from white”, the problem is you couldn’t even if you did – you have to be white first.

    created by nature for efficient removal of waste matter

    Ah, this gets to why you people can’t deal with the sewage in your filthy country. You think nature will just take care of it. No, once you poop in the road, its going to sit there for awhile.

    You should spend less time yapping here on your bizarre obsession with “WN wiggers” and more time in your filthy homeland figuring out how to deal with your sewage.

    • Replies: @Thomm
    er.... no one with an IQ above 70 thinks that I am an 'Indian'. In displaying your stupidity, you are revealing both your low IQ (70) and extreme homosexuality.

    If you took off your gimp suit and went outside once in a while, you might not have so much trouble evaluating the normal world, nor would you be so out of your depth when interacting with heterosexuals.

    Now, get off my lawn, faggot!
  55. That 40% figure is surprising to me. My guess is some answer this way to prove a point…to show what loyal WNs they are. It’s so hypothetical they can safely answer that way. Yet if they somehow got put in that situation they would choose the black girl over the white dude.

    • Replies: @Truth
    Dude, 40% is pretty G-D high.
    , @Thomm

    My guess is some answer this way to prove a point…to show what loyal WNs they are. It’s so hypothetical they can safely answer that way. Yet if they somehow got put in that situation they would choose the black girl over the white dude.
     
    It is apparent that they truly mean it. When they have convinced themselves that black people are subhuman, then they see a black woman as an animal, and sex with her as bestiality.

    Combine that with the fact that almost 100% of their interaction with fellow whites is with males (virtually no WN actually interacts with white females they are not directly related to, as white women are hypergamous and thus are very well attuned to this concept of which individuals are wastematter), and you get this astonishing degree of aberrant proclivities.

    It is an example of what happens when you combine extreme groupthink with Dunning-Kruger, on top of the fact that this subrace is genetically designated by nature itself to act as a carrier for disposal of unwanted genetic detritus. HBD theory explains it well.

    , @Audacious Epigone
    There are admittedly some things I have in common with white nationalists, though less than I thought after reading this!
  56. That’s what eight years of loyal service gets Biden–a snub!

    It wasn’t merely “loyal service” that Biden gave to Obama. Biden is what got him eleted in the first place. Not enough Americans would have been willing to take a chance on Balack O’Blacka if the staid, reliable, old white Washington hand, Joe Biden, wasn’t standing there behind him. He gave the whole Obama ticket a gravitas and an assurance of non-retribution that the Kenyan-Hawaiian-Indonesian-Mulatto-Muslim-Marxist-Faggot never could have brought to the party on his own.

    Obama has been the great disappearing president. He has basically vanished from the public eye ever since he left office, which is by design. It makes it difficult to recall just what a creepy and enigmatic little personality he was. America was not then, and is not now, truly ready for a standalone Obama-like candidate, and it is not ready for a Kamala Harris.

    Biden should have been the Democratic nominee in every election since 2004. I truly believe he would have won any one of them, including 2016. He is not only the strongest candidate against Trump, he is literally the Democrats’ only chance against Trump. They are fools if they don’t nominate him. He has shown great forbearance and patience in hanging on this long, playing second fiddle to inferior politicians. While I can’t stand his positions, I must admit to holding a begrudging admiration for his toughness.

    I think the prospect of Trump and Biden going at each other in the general election would actually be good for America. It is the one match-up the carries with it the possibility that matters of substance would come to the fore in the political dialogue. That is something we’re not going to get with the rest of the Idiocracy backbenchers.

    • Replies: @Truth
    Barry could have run with you, and gotten elected against McCain, Old Sport.
    , @Audacious Epigone
    There isn't an obvious corollary to Biden in 2008 for Harris in 2016. She might pick Buttigieg, but he's an attempted sop to flyover America, not the steady and staid hand of a grizzled political veteran. On the other hand, America in 2020 will be substantially different from America in 2008.
  57. GSS head’s up, it turns out that in 2004 they asked people to rank from 1-3 which group identity mattered to them. The variable was SOCID1. Too bad that was the only year they asked. For the record, these were the choices given:

    1) Job
    2) Race/ethnicity
    3) Gender
    4) Age Group
    5) Religion
    6) Political Party
    7) Nationality
    8) Family
    9) Social Class
    10) Region

    Among whites, “family” dominated getting 50% as the first choice

  58. @SunBakedSuburb
    "Most people - including whites - are horrified by them."

    Not "horrified," just disappointed. If you stepped down from your cloud you might recognize that these horrifying whites are seeking survival, not supremacy.

    It isn’t “ethnic groups” who want supremacy, but rather, it’s empires who have so much hubris. Hitler claimed that all great European empires were led by “Aryans”, whose greatness was only inhibited by traitors and non-Aryans. So empire builders often use (sometimes dubious) racial claims to further the cause of empire building; according to Hitler, all “Aryans” deserved to be the rulers of the world.

    The much talked about (in these parts) Anglo-Zionist alliance since the late 1940’s is quite obviously “supremacist” in it’s attempts to make the world revolve around Tel Aviv, London, and New York.

    The irony is that “white supremacist” Trump and his isolationist base merely want to have a world in which nobody is dominant, and we leave each other alone. Of course, the current variety of arrogant globalists (the Anglo-Zionists) makes the quite valid claim that an ideological retreat from world domination would create a vaccuum filled by someone other than the Anglo-Zionists; however, their claim that such people are inherently more “evil” or “illiberal” than the Anglo-Zionists is decidedly narcissistic and vapid, given that all empires beyond a certain point must commit a variety of abuses and betrayals in order to uphold their power and reach (or at least attempt such w/o necessarily succeeding).

    We also see the irony that modern globalists are trying to paint Western countries as oppressive police states which hate minorities and immigrants, while virtually nothing is said about misguided wars that kill tons of people needlessly (including native white Westerners).

  59. O/T

    The neo-Victorian “conservative feminism” awakens

    As I predict, we are going to see a lot of this in the coming decade.

    • Replies: @Audacious Epigone
    "Not sure how to resolve"

    Understand that men and women are biologically and psychologically different. There you go, dear, you're all set!
    , @L Woods
    “I want to have my cake and eat it too but my pea brain is incapable of spinning the necessary rationalization.”
  60. The following year, in 1992, a US strategic draft for the post-Cold War period was leaked to the press. The person responsible for the confusion, former Assistant Secretary of State, Paul Wolfowitz, confessed seven years later: “In 1992 a draft memo prepared by my office at the Pentagon … leaked to the press and sparked a major controversy.” The draft’s strategy aimed “to prevent any hostile power from dominating” a Eurasian region “whose resources would, under consolidated control, be sufficient to generate global power”. He added: “Senator Joseph Biden ridiculed the proposed strategy as ‘literally a Pax Americana … It won’t work …’ Just seven years later, many of these same critics seem quite comfortable with the idea of a Pax Americana.

    Looks like somebody needs to ask Joe Biden if America should keep “flexing it’s muscle” in order to “advance democracy”.

    • Replies: @Audacious Epigone
    Tulsi should do it. Biden spends the next month getting ready to dance around the racial bombshells and then, BAM!, a foreign policy sucker punch!
  61. @Achmed E. Newman
    Seems to me this is just infotainment, like a day at the races. It'd probably interest me only if I had some money on one of these horses, but I'm not even a gambler, so I honestly don't give a damn who wins what. Elections will solve nothing at this point. Watching these debates, had I desired to watch the idiot plate, would have just raised my blood pressure.

    Sorry, I know this is your thing, A.E., looking at the numbers. I do know where your money would be, as you've already gone out on a limb for Mrs. Harris. Good luck with that prediction - it'd be like Ann Coulter picking Trump back when there were 12 contenders in '15.

    I think it’s more than infotainment. There is a lot to be gleaned about American society in The Current Year from things like this. But I would think that, wouldn’t I?

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    You sure do like to glean stuff, A.E. ;-}
  62. @Truth
    Audie, what has happened ro you recently?
    You used to be such a logical numbers-based guy, now it seems like most of your stuff ia race-baiting and demanding reparations.

    Its a tad dissappointing from a seemingly intelligent man.

    I’ve never demanding reparations and this isn’t “race-baiting”, it’s having an honest conversation about race.

    • Replies: @Truth
    "Reparations" is just my umbrella term for all of the Al(abaster) Sharpton stuff you guys do about Duh man holdin' you down. As for race-baiting, let's again, examine a part of your post:


    I suspect the former president will not. That’s what eight years of loyal service gets Biden–a snub!
     
    Now ask yourself; "What exactly, does Barry owe Uncle Gropy?" I mean, first of all, it hasn't happened yet, secondly, who gave whom a F- Job.?"

    Unless you were referring to some other reason that Barry would decline to make an endorsement, rather then the one I conjured up out of nowhere in my pea brain, wardrobe, unpaid debts in a card game, whatever, then yes, I would consider this "race baiting."
  63. @alexander
    I think these poll results are proof positive that both CNN and Quinnipiac are total frauds...and probably have been for quite some time.

    They exist only for the 1%, are designed by the 1%, and tell us exactly what the 1% want us to think.

    The entire country despises our establishment just as much as it despises our phony media.

    The entire country thinks the DNC debates were a complete joke, with the one exception of Tulsi Gabbard.

    I cannot imagine even one American citizen actually voting for Joe Biden today.

    These polling company's are nothing more than bought off tools of our corrupt establishment.

    Their results are as fixed and phony as "the WMD's in Iraq".

    That it were so, my good man, that it were so.

  64. @alexander
    Let us just stop and think about what ISN'T being addressed in our debates.


    The fact that every single American,.... brown , white, black, yellow, red, pink and blue is now TWENTY TWO TRILLION DOLLARS IN HEINOUS DEBT because we were all LIED into ILLEGAL WAR.

    Where is the discussion ?

    Where is the debate ?

    Where is the demand for accountability?

    Where is the recognition that defrauding the American people into illegal war of aggression is a CRIME ?

    Where is the recognition that the wars our media lied us into have nearly exterminated the entire solvency of the United States ?


    Nothing...

    Zero.....Zilch.....

    Nada.


    The entire crop of DNC candidates are all tools and total frauds, who could give two sh#ts about the American People , our country, its solvency .....and its future.

    Shameful.


    What a disgrace .

    Tulsi tried. Here’s to her continuing to try.

    But she’s elegant, composed, and pretty, yet the reaction to her is a big yawn.

    • Replies: @Feryl
    But populism, the real kind, is too radioactive right now to the Dem base. They want "minority" populism (ya know, only a minority of morons thinks that free college and open borders is a great idea, and stuff like reparations is guaranteed to win approval from self-appointed guardians of "minorities" while alienating everyone else).

    It's ID politics or bust; not only are Dems disinterested in populism, at the moment, but even comfy centrism appears to be on the way out (were this not the case, then Biden and Buttigieg would be doing better, and Sanders would be badly fading; Sanders is still hanging on to some degree, and no amount of "anointing" from the mainstream/Dem establishment is going to propel Biden).

    There was a thought (hope?) that the Dem race would be about the base encouraging a "moderate"/Centrist who could capably take on Trump in the heartland. But those designs have been foiled by the early debates, which became a massive Wokefest that raised the blood pressure of all but the most die-hard ID politics devotees. The base, and the candidates trying to stay in touch with it, are all competing to see who can dis the heartland normies the most. They may not literally say "basket of deplorables", but their supposed policy stances say the same thing. "Purity" (and "virtue") over pragmatism. Like the GOP running a social Darwinist in 1948, or something, to send the message that they weren't being corrupted by New Dealism.
    , @alexander
    Face it , Audacious, the entire D.N.C is totally down the tubes.

    Their entire crop of nominees are prepackaged corrupt establishment puppets.

    They are nothing more than DNC Hillary "clones" , with Joe and Kamala as "Clone One and Clone Two"...... respectively.

    There is one candidate,.... and one candidate alone ....., who is NOT a Hillary "clone".

    Tulsi Gabbard.

    She is the ONLY DNC candidate who can crush Trump ....and take the White House.

    The rest....have already lost.
  65. @Sid
    Buttigieg is definitely the SWPL candidate of choice. Well educated, highly literate, and he appears to be a respectable gay man married to a husband, and not a creepy degenerate.

    So that means he has no shot.

    Biden could beat Trump, probably quite easily, if he could skip the primaries and face Trump. But as I've said elsewhere, he has to answer for his erstwhile friendliness with Dixiecrats, and he'll have to make lots of Woke statements which will dampen his appeal to WWC voters.

    Harris and Warren will have the hardest time poaching Trump voters. That said, who has the best chance of winning in 2020 between them is debatable. Harris will galvanize the black vote, but there's nothing about her appealing to any category of white voters in particular. Warren won't garner much black enthusiasm. On the other hand, I have to admit that while I object to her character and most of her policies, I can't deny her statements against the plutocracy are appealing and may peel off much of the WWC.

    ---

    It'll be interesting to see if Biden and Harris split the black vote. If so, Buttigieg, Bernie, and Warren have a shot if white liberals rally around one of them. Of course, showing any sort of preference for white Americans is anathema to what it means to be a Democrat nowadays, so I doubt the contradiction could hold!

    Biden, who was never particularly adroit when he was younger and is even more flat-footed now, isn’t going to be able to thread the racial needle. He’ll end up bloodying his hands up beyond recognition, I think.

  66. @Twinkie

    They are just moochers.
     
    They are fellow Americans who feel alienated and marginalized. The correct solution is to address their concerns and, where there is common interest (and there is), achieve the goals of those shared interests. A healthy, strong America wouldn’t produce many white nationalists. White nationalism is a symptom of our nation’s current malaise, it is neither the cause nor a solution.

    Plus, there is also the HBD angle that I have described at length before. Intra-white variance is very high (brains, looks, talent, character), and the least desirable traits concentrate in specific carriers. No other race possesses this distributive feature. This is a mechanism created by nature for efficient removal of waste matter, which keeps the other 80% of whites tip-top.
     
    This is complete nonsense. You are as scientifically misinformed as the people whom you purport to disparage.

    “White nationalism is a symptom of our nation’s current malaise, it is neither the cause nor a solution.”

    So called white nationalism is a symptom of an ever increasing non white population infesting the United States, making demands for access to whites’ wealth and or power and or communities.

    If the non white population of the US were under 10%, there would be no white nationalism, because it wouldn’t be necessary.

    But no – you think what America needs is a few million more east Asians to build “high trust”, Tahla thinks the US needs a few million more muslim Pakistanis, and Thomm thinks the US needs a few million more of his closest H1V Hindu 1st cousins, and Truth want a few trillion more dollars to facilitate all the kids he fathered that he doesn’t know about, while cucks like iffen and Feryl look forward to handing their daughters over to any of them.

    And then you want to slander whites as “white nationalists” (read: racist) for daring to notice the walls closing in on the people who built the country to begin with.

    • Replies: @216

    But no – you think what America needs is a few million more east Asians to build “high trust”, Tahla thinks the US needs a few million more muslim Pakistanis, and Thomm thinks the US needs a few million more of his closest H1V Hindu 1st cousins, and Truth want a few trillion more dollars to facilitate all the kids he fathered that he doesn’t know about, while cucks like iffen and Feryl look forward to handing their daughters over to any of them.
     
    You can say that all you want, it might even be true. But untold numbers of people think that White Americans are entitled rich kids getting a lesson in humility.
    , @Talha

    Tahla thinks the US needs a few million more muslim Pakistanis
     
    Nope - wrong. I’ve never said that.

    What I want is a few million more converts to Islam from the people that already live here (hopefully this will kick up the native stock TFR); I am completely uninterested in importing more immigrants of any background.

    Peace.
    , @iffen
    while cucks like iffen

    Time out, Twinkie.

    I am not a cuck, you ignorant cocksucker. I said that you were in over your head. I was wrong. You are in over your boot tops. Of all the ignorant dipwad WNs that comment here, you are one of the least intelligent. Not that I hold that against you, your low IQ being out of your control.
    , @Truth

    and Truth want a few trillion more dollars to facilitate all the kids he fathered that he doesn’t know about, while cucks like iffen and Feryl look forward to handing their daughters over to any of them.
     
    I'm liking the way you think, Rabbi Mordechai, I'm just hoping those aren't mutually exclusive fantasies.
    , @Twinkie

    you think what America needs is a few million more east Asians to build “high trust”
     
    I’m an immigration restrictionist, including that from Asia.
    , @Feryl
    I'm not going to be marching with Dickie Spencer any time soon. The Nazi LARPing*, and the wannabe tough guy/warrior stuff is a bit much.


    *The Nazis representing a declining empire run by people suffering from various degrees of foolishness. They had vast delusions of grandeur, believed in pseudo-science and pseudo-history (saying that all good, or at least strong, people had been "Aryans"), and wanted to liquidate those seen to be historical enemies of Germany (primarily Slavs, of course). The primarily Gen Z idiots who thought it would be, in any way, funny or "effective" to co-opt Nazi stuff for memes or actual ideology are total bufoons who don't deserve "their" own country. Go out and actually get to know people, hang out with them. They don't want to hear crank bull-shit about any one being "entitled" to that which is supposedly "theirs". People get the sort of society they deserve and ask for, and the good guys usually win in the end (hint: in the early-mid 20th century, no German regime could be characterized as "the good guys"; that's why they lost, they were decadent and foolish, and deserved to be humiliated, unlike the Brits, the French, The Russians, and the Americans who had better leadership).

    Losing "our country"? Do you think the Indians might beg to differ? How about the traditional inhabitants of SE Asia, or much of modern Russia? Tribes grow, move in, get stronger, etc. That's how it is. Western Europeans had it too good, for too long; they got complacent. There's nothing any one person can do to alter the trajectory of history; even Hitler, at the end of the day, was a product of his culture and people, if he hadn't been crazy enough to lead Germany at the peak of it's arrogance then someone else would have.
    , @Feryl
    Mike, most American whites don't even like other white people right now. This isn't the New Deal era, when most Americans were robustly confident and happy. At any rate, go tell Appalachian whites that they are in dire need of aligning with Yankees from New York and the Pac. NW. They'll laugh in your face. America has been culturally and regionally fractured, not just ethnically fractured both within and between different groups.

    It's never a good idea to be a globalist empire. End of story. These things don't end well. It began to go sour w/Vietnam, and it's been declining ever since. Sorry. Our elites have a lot humbling events in their future.
  67. 216 says:
    @MikeatMikedotMike
    "White nationalism is a symptom of our nation’s current malaise, it is neither the cause nor a solution."

    So called white nationalism is a symptom of an ever increasing non white population infesting the United States, making demands for access to whites' wealth and or power and or communities.

    If the non white population of the US were under 10%, there would be no white nationalism, because it wouldn't be necessary.


    But no - you think what America needs is a few million more east Asians to build "high trust", Tahla thinks the US needs a few million more muslim Pakistanis, and Thomm thinks the US needs a few million more of his closest H1V Hindu 1st cousins, and Truth want a few trillion more dollars to facilitate all the kids he fathered that he doesn't know about, while cucks like iffen and Feryl look forward to handing their daughters over to any of them.

    And then you want to slander whites as "white nationalists" (read: racist) for daring to notice the walls closing in on the people who built the country to begin with.

    But no – you think what America needs is a few million more east Asians to build “high trust”, Tahla thinks the US needs a few million more muslim Pakistanis, and Thomm thinks the US needs a few million more of his closest H1V Hindu 1st cousins, and Truth want a few trillion more dollars to facilitate all the kids he fathered that he doesn’t know about, while cucks like iffen and Feryl look forward to handing their daughters over to any of them.

    You can say that all you want, it might even be true. But untold numbers of people think that White Americans are entitled rich kids getting a lesson in humility.

    • Replies: @Audacious Epigone
    Yep, even the Brahmin children of Hindu professionals when they look at dilapidated ghost towns in Appalachia. White privilege!
    , @MikeatMikedotMike
    "But untold numbers of people think that White Americans are entitled rich kids getting a lesson in humility."

    And YOU can believe that steaming pile of horseshit all you want. Envy is no less a sin than pride. And we're going to see who learns a lesson when the shooting starts.
  68. @MikeatMikedotMike
    "White nationalism is a symptom of our nation’s current malaise, it is neither the cause nor a solution."

    So called white nationalism is a symptom of an ever increasing non white population infesting the United States, making demands for access to whites' wealth and or power and or communities.

    If the non white population of the US were under 10%, there would be no white nationalism, because it wouldn't be necessary.


    But no - you think what America needs is a few million more east Asians to build "high trust", Tahla thinks the US needs a few million more muslim Pakistanis, and Thomm thinks the US needs a few million more of his closest H1V Hindu 1st cousins, and Truth want a few trillion more dollars to facilitate all the kids he fathered that he doesn't know about, while cucks like iffen and Feryl look forward to handing their daughters over to any of them.

    And then you want to slander whites as "white nationalists" (read: racist) for daring to notice the walls closing in on the people who built the country to begin with.

    Tahla thinks the US needs a few million more muslim Pakistanis

    Nope – wrong. I’ve never said that.

    What I want is a few million more converts to Islam from the people that already live here (hopefully this will kick up the native stock TFR); I am completely uninterested in importing more immigrants of any background.

    Peace.

    • Replies: @iffen
    I am completely uninterested in importing more immigrants of any background.

    Yeah, it's kind of the story for all immigrants. If you wanted to be there with those people, why come here?
    , @Talha
    I’m talking guys like this:
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=pQG-oIMSbco

    And this:
    https://www.qalam.institute/abdelrahman-murphy

    And this:
    https://www.joebradford.net/about-me/

    And this:
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=gfeLyTU5z0E
  69. @Twinkie

    They are just moochers.
     
    They are fellow Americans who feel alienated and marginalized. The correct solution is to address their concerns and, where there is common interest (and there is), achieve the goals of those shared interests. A healthy, strong America wouldn’t produce many white nationalists. White nationalism is a symptom of our nation’s current malaise, it is neither the cause nor a solution.

    Plus, there is also the HBD angle that I have described at length before. Intra-white variance is very high (brains, looks, talent, character), and the least desirable traits concentrate in specific carriers. No other race possesses this distributive feature. This is a mechanism created by nature for efficient removal of waste matter, which keeps the other 80% of whites tip-top.
     
    This is complete nonsense. You are as scientifically misinformed as the people whom you purport to disparage.

    You nailed it, Twinkie. Now let this ignorant dipwad fade.

  70. @MikeatMikedotMike
    "White nationalism is a symptom of our nation’s current malaise, it is neither the cause nor a solution."

    So called white nationalism is a symptom of an ever increasing non white population infesting the United States, making demands for access to whites' wealth and or power and or communities.

    If the non white population of the US were under 10%, there would be no white nationalism, because it wouldn't be necessary.


    But no - you think what America needs is a few million more east Asians to build "high trust", Tahla thinks the US needs a few million more muslim Pakistanis, and Thomm thinks the US needs a few million more of his closest H1V Hindu 1st cousins, and Truth want a few trillion more dollars to facilitate all the kids he fathered that he doesn't know about, while cucks like iffen and Feryl look forward to handing their daughters over to any of them.

    And then you want to slander whites as "white nationalists" (read: racist) for daring to notice the walls closing in on the people who built the country to begin with.

    while cucks like iffen

    Time out, Twinkie.

    I am not a cuck, you ignorant cocksucker. I said that you were in over your head. I was wrong. You are in over your boot tops. Of all the ignorant dipwad WNs that comment here, you are one of the least intelligent. Not that I hold that against you, your low IQ being out of your control.

    • Replies: @MikeatMikedotMike
    LOL - you're the biggest cuck on Ae's comment section. Go cry to your negro co-workers about it.
  71. @Talha

    Tahla thinks the US needs a few million more muslim Pakistanis
     
    Nope - wrong. I’ve never said that.

    What I want is a few million more converts to Islam from the people that already live here (hopefully this will kick up the native stock TFR); I am completely uninterested in importing more immigrants of any background.

    Peace.

    I am completely uninterested in importing more immigrants of any background.

    Yeah, it’s kind of the story for all immigrants. If you wanted to be there with those people, why come here?

    • Replies: @Talha
    Exactly - there’s kind of a reason why my dad brought us here when he was given the chance.

    Peace.
  72. @Twinkie

    I stand by my previous assertion that Trump’s toughest potential matchup is Biden while his easiest is Warren.
     
    I agree with this. Sanders, Harris, and Warren all have potentially fatal flaws as candidates in the general election. Most American voters aren't quite ready to embrace Sanders' overt socialism, Harris comes off as a grievance ("black-Indian-female") candidate who has coasted on a powerful man (of which other former - and failed - candidate does that remind you?), and Warren is a fake American Indian who got a Harvard job with affirmative action fraud.

    Biden comes off as the least offensive to the general public. Sure, he's a creepy guy who can't keep his hands off women and children and often says strange and borderline senile things, but he comes off as vaguely centrist and usually mild-mannered. He appears harmless enough to have a beer with at a bar. His hurdles are that he doesn't generate excitement among the left's base and that he is old (he missed his opportunity - should have run against Hillary and possibly against Trump the first time around).

    Biden comes off as the least offensive to the general public. Sure, he’s a creepy guy who can’t keep his hands off women and children and often says strange and borderline senile things,

    Oh, is that all?

  73. @Thomm
    Truth, my man!

    There have been some important comedy updates.

    1) Note that I got no less than 17 replies to a post that has been posted a fourth time :

    http://www.unz.com/pgiraldi/israels-role-in-9-11/#comment-3238635

    The first post got 36 replies, but it is more damning that the fourth posting got 17 replies. These individuals are exceptionally convinced of their narrative.

    2) Elsewhere, I have created a second song for the WN wiggers. In addition to the legendary first song, 'Little Shop of Wiggers', which you recall, I had to create an additional entry that is less dependent on American pop culture and more tied to timeless classics.

    Hence, I chose Italian libretto Opera. At the right time, I will post the new song, titled 'The Marriage of Wigger-O', from the Opera, 'The Wigger of Seville'. The marriage is of course a gay marriage, which is to be expected given the infamous proclivites of the WN demographic.

    An excerpt as a teaser : think of 'Figaro', and replace it with 'Wigger-O', to the tune of :

    "Wigger-O
    Wigger-O
    Wigger-O
    Wigger-O, Wigger-O, Wigger-O, Wigger-O, Wigger-O, Wigger-O"

    https://youtu.be/3Qy_7iEtXZM?t=69


    Heh heh heh heh

    Keep pumpin’ that jab Dawg. He’s bleeding, eventually the ref will stop it…

    • Replies: @Thomm

    Keep pumpin’ that jab Dawg. He’s bleeding, eventually the ref will stop it…
     
    Oh, it is not that. These songs are very well received by the audience in question. The previous song was and still is being consumed zealously, as it has become their theme song to rally around. They enjoy it even as we speak.

    This new Operatic release is a major and profound addition to this growing genre of art.
  74. @Audacious Epigone
    I think it's more than infotainment. There is a lot to be gleaned about American society in The Current Year from things like this. But I would think that, wouldn't I?

    You sure do like to glean stuff, A.E. ;-}

    • Replies: @Audacious Epigone
    Guilty as charged.
  75. @Sid
    Buttigieg is definitely the SWPL candidate of choice. Well educated, highly literate, and he appears to be a respectable gay man married to a husband, and not a creepy degenerate.

    So that means he has no shot.

    Biden could beat Trump, probably quite easily, if he could skip the primaries and face Trump. But as I've said elsewhere, he has to answer for his erstwhile friendliness with Dixiecrats, and he'll have to make lots of Woke statements which will dampen his appeal to WWC voters.

    Harris and Warren will have the hardest time poaching Trump voters. That said, who has the best chance of winning in 2020 between them is debatable. Harris will galvanize the black vote, but there's nothing about her appealing to any category of white voters in particular. Warren won't garner much black enthusiasm. On the other hand, I have to admit that while I object to her character and most of her policies, I can't deny her statements against the plutocracy are appealing and may peel off much of the WWC.

    ---

    It'll be interesting to see if Biden and Harris split the black vote. If so, Buttigieg, Bernie, and Warren have a shot if white liberals rally around one of them. Of course, showing any sort of preference for white Americans is anathema to what it means to be a Democrat nowadays, so I doubt the contradiction could hold!

    Buttigieg is definitely the SWPL candidate of choice. Well educated, highly literate, and he appears to be a respectable gay man married to a husband, and not a creepy degenerate.

    Wow, I guess I’m really not in 1993 anymore.

    • Replies: @Audacious Epigone
    He doesn't ping my gaydar much at all. Is there any controversy about the sincerity of his homosexuality?
    , @Sid
    It isn't. Gay men who at least give off the appearance of monogamous marital commitment are highly appealing to SWPLs.
  76. @TomSchmidt
    At least Tulsi seems to want to stop digging this particular hole.

    I want to climb to the roof of a 6 story building, jump off, flap my arms and fly… and I think my chances are superior than those of some puppet halting the military industrial complex from causing catastrophic damage to our “enemies.”

  77. @Twodees Partain
    You forgot to mention that you're black. You aren't of course, but you need to harp on it lest people forget.

    “Loookie…lookie…lookie…lookie…”

  78. @TomSchmidt
    I'm sure when Barack Obama opposed gay marriage in 2008 he thought the same thing: Congress will never enact it. Of course, it WAS enacted, which points to how reparations will come about.

    Blacks never faulted Obama for the utter collapse in black wealth over the 2009-2014 period, so it's reasonable to assume they won't hold Harris accountable for failing to directly deliver reparations.

    There's still no such thing as too cynical.

    I’m sure when Barack Obama opposed gay marriage in 2008 he thought the same thing: Congress will never enact it. Of course, it WAS enacted, which points to how reparations will come about.

    These plans are made 50 years in advance, Old Sport, and the Puppet in command knows about them well before he takes office.

  79. @Rosie
    AE: The Atlantic is blaming marriage (!) for the isolation and loneliness of modern life.

    https://amp.theatlantic.com/amp/article/591973/


    The hair of the dog that bitcha!

    Remember when they said same-sex marriage would, if anything, strengthen the institution of marriage? Ha!

  80. @neutral
    The Founding Fathers did not want non whites in government, women in government, homosexual marriage, miscegenation, porn seen as free speech, whites forced to pay non whites, foreign policy run by Israel, censorship outsourced to corporations, whites being ethnically cleansed, Christianity being replaced by the LGBTABC123 cult, etc.

    So being worried about when they should start their election campaigns is hardly the biggest problem here.

    Well, they were all wierdo deist homosexuals, as are all men above a certain level of power, influence or riches, so this is debatable.

  81. 3308166

    Where are you sourcing this putative 80/20 split from?

    • Replies: @Thomm

    Where are you sourcing this putative 80/20 split from?
     
    It is an estimation from what little official data there is, combined with anecdotal observation.

    Heartiste has estimated that it is really just 10-12%.
  82. @Aft

    So it makes for some fascinating calculus: can Harris support reparations to win the primary, and then abandon the people who supported her to win the general?
     
    Can a politician who seems pretty slick do what every politician ever does? Probably. Congress would never enact it so it's a moot point anyway.

    “never” is a long time.

  83. @Twinkie

    They are just moochers.
     
    They are fellow Americans who feel alienated and marginalized. The correct solution is to address their concerns and, where there is common interest (and there is), achieve the goals of those shared interests. A healthy, strong America wouldn’t produce many white nationalists. White nationalism is a symptom of our nation’s current malaise, it is neither the cause nor a solution.

    Plus, there is also the HBD angle that I have described at length before. Intra-white variance is very high (brains, looks, talent, character), and the least desirable traits concentrate in specific carriers. No other race possesses this distributive feature. This is a mechanism created by nature for efficient removal of waste matter, which keeps the other 80% of whites tip-top.
     
    This is complete nonsense. You are as scientifically misinformed as the people whom you purport to disparage.


    They are fellow Americans who feel alienated and marginalized.
    The correct solution is to address their concerns and, where there is common interest (and there is), achieve the goals of those shared interests.

    Wow! you know, I agree with you Twinx, and I feel that there are other groups who fit this description, although I can’t think of whom they are right now…

    • Replies: @Twinkie

    I feel that there are other groups who fit this description, although I can’t think of whom they are right now…
     
    Go bark up another tree. I’ve written time and again that I want fulfillment and dignity for all my fellow Americans, including, yes, blacks - at minimum, because our fates are tied. Black problems eventually become those for other Americans sooner or later.

    I want blacks to do better than they have in the past, but that doesn’t mean I think they are capable of achieving the same level of prosperity as other groups. I don’t believe in “closing the gap” - I believe in people doing as best as they can, realistically. Not everyone is born with the same abilities, whether as individuals or as groups.
  84. @Jay Fink
    @Thomm

    That 40% figure is surprising to me. My guess is some answer this way to prove a point...to show what loyal WNs they are. It's so hypothetical they can safely answer that way. Yet if they somehow got put in that situation they would choose the black girl over the white dude.

    Dude, 40% is pretty G-D high.

  85. @Talha

    Tahla thinks the US needs a few million more muslim Pakistanis
     
    Nope - wrong. I’ve never said that.

    What I want is a few million more converts to Islam from the people that already live here (hopefully this will kick up the native stock TFR); I am completely uninterested in importing more immigrants of any background.

    Peace.

    I’m talking guys like this:

    And this:
    https://www.qalam.institute/abdelrahman-murphy

    And this:
    https://www.joebradford.net/about-me/

    And this:

  86. @Aft
    So we get the candidate 6% think is best for the economy....on the idea electing her and giving race-based handouts (in addition to the 2:1 margin by which blacks use welfare and all other programs more) will improve race relations.

    What about LBQTIABCD where are their reparations for past mistreatment? Anyone suffer on their way sneaking into the country? Liberals with brain trauma from Trump?

    Any handout to 14% of the population is not good for relations among some other lower IQ, lower achieving groups one would think, and definitely not for relations as perceived by whites--in short, she's the winning candidate on the issue that she'll make America much worse on.

    Presumably the best person for “race relations” would be an accommodating, affable non-white who talked about bringing people together as Americans. That’s what Obama did in 2004. That it was a presumably a grift doesn’t matter–it was what America wanted to hear then. Fifteen years later, the high priestesses of Wokeness demand something much less… pacific.

  87. @UrbaneFrancoOntarian
    >Makes a mathematical and statistical post about Dem. candidates polling numbers
    ...
    >Wahh why are you race baiting!!

    >Makes a mathematical and statistical post about Dem. candidates polling numbers

    I suspect the former president will not. That’s what eight years of loyal service gets Biden–a snub!

    Mathematical and statistical analyses generally do not start with “I suspect”, although in total transparency, I must admit, I never progressed beyond Trig.

    • Replies: @Audacious Epigone
    May I offer a little color commentary from time to time? Please, for my sanity, grant me permission to do so. I'm not a robot, man!
  88. @iffen
    I am completely uninterested in importing more immigrants of any background.

    Yeah, it's kind of the story for all immigrants. If you wanted to be there with those people, why come here?

    Exactly – there’s kind of a reason why my dad brought us here when he was given the chance.

    Peace.

  89. @Intelligent Dasein

    That’s what eight years of loyal service gets Biden–a snub!
     
    It wasn't merely "loyal service" that Biden gave to Obama. Biden is what got him eleted in the first place. Not enough Americans would have been willing to take a chance on Balack O'Blacka if the staid, reliable, old white Washington hand, Joe Biden, wasn't standing there behind him. He gave the whole Obama ticket a gravitas and an assurance of non-retribution that the Kenyan-Hawaiian-Indonesian-Mulatto-Muslim-Marxist-Faggot never could have brought to the party on his own.

    Obama has been the great disappearing president. He has basically vanished from the public eye ever since he left office, which is by design. It makes it difficult to recall just what a creepy and enigmatic little personality he was. America was not then, and is not now, truly ready for a standalone Obama-like candidate, and it is not ready for a Kamala Harris.

    Biden should have been the Democratic nominee in every election since 2004. I truly believe he would have won any one of them, including 2016. He is not only the strongest candidate against Trump, he is literally the Democrats' only chance against Trump. They are fools if they don't nominate him. He has shown great forbearance and patience in hanging on this long, playing second fiddle to inferior politicians. While I can't stand his positions, I must admit to holding a begrudging admiration for his toughness.

    I think the prospect of Trump and Biden going at each other in the general election would actually be good for America. It is the one match-up the carries with it the possibility that matters of substance would come to the fore in the political dialogue. That is something we're not going to get with the rest of the Idiocracy backbenchers.

    Barry could have run with you, and gotten elected against McCain, Old Sport.

  90. @95Theses
    Not entirely OT, but has anyone had a chance to see the latest Air Force recruitment YouTube video? Nauseating.

    Voiceover narration begins thusly, “Every superhero has an origin story.”

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y-WElLXQfcA

    Ask those women what their childrens’ origins stories will be!

    Instead of having a family of their own, we send our nubile women to drop bombs on Yemeni families that don’t even have electricity or running water.

    We have really lost our way.

  91. @Audacious Epigone
    I've never demanding reparations and this isn't "race-baiting", it's having an honest conversation about race.

    “Reparations” is just my umbrella term for all of the Al(abaster) Sharpton stuff you guys do about Duh man holdin’ you down. As for race-baiting, let’s again, examine a part of your post:

    I suspect the former president will not. That’s what eight years of loyal service gets Biden–a snub!

    Now ask yourself; “What exactly, does Barry owe Uncle Gropy?” I mean, first of all, it hasn’t happened yet, secondly, who gave whom a F- Job.?”

    Unless you were referring to some other reason that Barry would decline to make an endorsement, rather then the one I conjured up out of nowhere in my pea brain, wardrobe, unpaid debts in a card game, whatever, then yes, I would consider this “race baiting.”

    • Replies: @Audacious Epigone
    I doubt Obama will risk endorsing a white candidate against a non-white candidate while the two are competitive with one another. I'd be happy to be proven wrong, and maybe I will be.
    , @iffen
    I would consider this “race baiting.”

    AE appears to expect loyalty from opportunistic politicians. I am certain that neither Obama or Biden make that mistake.

    Along the same lines, now that blacks are abandoning Biden, all those pundits that wrote all those paragraphs praising blacks for showing loyalty and gratitude are going to have do a lot of memory holing.
  92. @UrbaneFrancoOntarian

    utter collapse in black wealth over the 2009-2014 period
     
    Source?

    Yes, this was actually Barry’s purpose for winning (S)election to the White House. Or, more acurately, one of them, the rest are worse for blacks and better for whites. Oh, and by the way, Camacho’s purpose is to do the same to the Caucasoid middle class. And yes, you voted for him.*

    https://www.peoplespolicyproject.org/2017/12/07/destruction-of-black-wealth-during-the-obama-presidency/

    https://www.peoplespolicyproject.org/2017/12/07/destruction-of-black-wealth-during-the-obama-presidency/

    *PS, I know you’re one of those Raptor fans, but you would if you could.

    • Replies: @Talha

    Camacho
     
    LOOOL! I love it that you keep calling The Orange One that, keep it up!

    Peace.
  93. 216 says:
    @UrbaneFrancoOntarian
    Yup.

    Especially agree with the shout out to Twinkie and Talha. They are good people, sure. But they have to go back since they're racial aliens.

    Furthermore, watch how defensive Twinkie gets when it comes to anything Asian vs. Whites. He's no different from any other Asian, ultra thin skinned and sensitive when it comes to his own race.

    "White nationalism" is literally just a white person with common sense around race. White advocate, white supremacist, doesnt matter. It is simply a white person who is aware of the impending consequences of being a minority (hint: it gets ugly for us).

    No matter how right or consistent you might be, this attitude reeks of disrespect and entitlement. I don’t think we are going anywhere as political movements when it so easily slips out that even allied figures are to be victims of state power.

    It is simply a white person who is aware of the impending consequences of being a minority (hint: it gets ugly for us).

    At the present, we have minimal support from outside, against a large mob of Woke that eagerly await stripping us of privilege. Our image is that of either uneducated hicks, or rich kids unwilling to share.

    And you want to alienate our allies.

    Why not go slut shame some white women?

    • LOL: Talha
    • Replies: @Talha
    I appreciate the sentiment, but I personally don’t mind leaving to a Muslim country if it comes up to a vote and the majority decide such. Not a problem for me, but my wife will be really pissed off (she seems to think she has just as much right as any other White to be here - women, who listens to their husbands these days?).

    The guys that are going to be crying and kicking and screaming are the pozzed ex-Muslims that will literally have their liberal dreams completely shattered:
    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D-b4tj5XYAA0oW4.jpg

    Man, that is going to be one wild boat ride to Dar ul-Islam.

    I am concerned about the native converts like the ones I mentioned; they are sons of this land.

    Peace.
  94. @Truth
    Keep pumpin' that jab Dawg. He's bleeding, eventually the ref will stop it...

    Keep pumpin’ that jab Dawg. He’s bleeding, eventually the ref will stop it…

    Oh, it is not that. These songs are very well received by the audience in question. The previous song was and still is being consumed zealously, as it has become their theme song to rally around. They enjoy it even as we speak.

    This new Operatic release is a major and profound addition to this growing genre of art.

    • LOL: Truth
  95. @Intelligent Dasein

    That’s what eight years of loyal service gets Biden–a snub!
     
    It wasn't merely "loyal service" that Biden gave to Obama. Biden is what got him eleted in the first place. Not enough Americans would have been willing to take a chance on Balack O'Blacka if the staid, reliable, old white Washington hand, Joe Biden, wasn't standing there behind him. He gave the whole Obama ticket a gravitas and an assurance of non-retribution that the Kenyan-Hawaiian-Indonesian-Mulatto-Muslim-Marxist-Faggot never could have brought to the party on his own.

    Obama has been the great disappearing president. He has basically vanished from the public eye ever since he left office, which is by design. It makes it difficult to recall just what a creepy and enigmatic little personality he was. America was not then, and is not now, truly ready for a standalone Obama-like candidate, and it is not ready for a Kamala Harris.

    Biden should have been the Democratic nominee in every election since 2004. I truly believe he would have won any one of them, including 2016. He is not only the strongest candidate against Trump, he is literally the Democrats' only chance against Trump. They are fools if they don't nominate him. He has shown great forbearance and patience in hanging on this long, playing second fiddle to inferior politicians. While I can't stand his positions, I must admit to holding a begrudging admiration for his toughness.

    I think the prospect of Trump and Biden going at each other in the general election would actually be good for America. It is the one match-up the carries with it the possibility that matters of substance would come to the fore in the political dialogue. That is something we're not going to get with the rest of the Idiocracy backbenchers.

    There isn’t an obvious corollary to Biden in 2008 for Harris in 2016. She might pick Buttigieg, but he’s an attempted sop to flyover America, not the steady and staid hand of a grizzled political veteran. On the other hand, America in 2020 will be substantially different from America in 2008.

    • Replies: @HBS
    The more lethal picks for VP that Harris could make is either Sen. Bob Casey or Gov. Tom Wolf both of Pennsylvania.
  96. @MikeatMikedotMike
    "White nationalism is a symptom of our nation’s current malaise, it is neither the cause nor a solution."

    So called white nationalism is a symptom of an ever increasing non white population infesting the United States, making demands for access to whites' wealth and or power and or communities.

    If the non white population of the US were under 10%, there would be no white nationalism, because it wouldn't be necessary.


    But no - you think what America needs is a few million more east Asians to build "high trust", Tahla thinks the US needs a few million more muslim Pakistanis, and Thomm thinks the US needs a few million more of his closest H1V Hindu 1st cousins, and Truth want a few trillion more dollars to facilitate all the kids he fathered that he doesn't know about, while cucks like iffen and Feryl look forward to handing their daughters over to any of them.

    And then you want to slander whites as "white nationalists" (read: racist) for daring to notice the walls closing in on the people who built the country to begin with.

    and Truth want a few trillion more dollars to facilitate all the kids he fathered that he doesn’t know about, while cucks like iffen and Feryl look forward to handing their daughters over to any of them.

    I’m liking the way you think, Rabbi Mordechai, I’m just hoping those aren’t mutually exclusive fantasies.

  97. @Truth
    Yes, this was actually Barry's purpose for winning (S)election to the White House. Or, more acurately, one of them, the rest are worse for blacks and better for whites. Oh, and by the way, Camacho's purpose is to do the same to the Caucasoid middle class. And yes, you voted for him.*

    https://www.peoplespolicyproject.org/2017/12/07/destruction-of-black-wealth-during-the-obama-presidency/

    https://www.peoplespolicyproject.org/2017/12/07/destruction-of-black-wealth-during-the-obama-presidency/

    *PS, I know you're one of those Raptor fans, but you would if you could.

    Camacho

    LOOOL! I love it that you keep calling The Orange One that, keep it up!

    Peace.

  98. @UrbaneFrancoOntarian
    >Makes a mathematical and statistical post about Dem. candidates polling numbers
    ...
    >Wahh why are you race baiting!!

    Ha, indeed. I thought maybe I was missing something but couldn’t figure out exactly what it was. Maybe the “this is the future you chose, Joe”. That’s not race-baiting, that’s pointing out that what happened to Biden is what logically follows from the white-supremacists-are-everywhere tact Biden has taken for a over a decade now.

  99. @UrbaneFrancoOntarian

    utter collapse in black wealth over the 2009-2014 period
     
    Source?

    Truth stole my response. There are others. Late in the Obama administration, the average net worth of a black woman was $5. You could Google that one.

    • Replies: @216
    Some people cannot be trusted with debt.

    Conservatives with their "muh free market" and "personal responsibility" don't get this. Usury is ruinous.
  100. @UrbaneFrancoOntarian
    Cringe.

    The artic alliance is pure cringe.

    Coping for whites who want an ally.

    Hey whitey: Asian males hate you. They hate you because you're better looking than them, you're taller than them, their women thirst after you, because you 'sold them opium', you are just better, you have lighter skin, etc. etc. etc.

    Non-whites do not like white men nor will they look after them at all. Grow up.

    Surveys consistently show the greatest expressed amount of interracial trust and understanding between whites and Asians than between any other major racial pairings. There are resentments, and I have no idea what a so-called Arctic Alliance would mean or look like, exactly, but the idea that Asian men are at white men’s throats is sensationalist, I think.

    • Replies: @216
    Ever read r/Hapa or r/AsianMasculinity?

    If you did that would be a logical conclusion, but these are radicalized communties that don't represent reality.

    The data, ahem, shows that white men are more likely to outmarry than white women; so UFO would be better apt to shame the males that exploit the SMV gradient. Which ironically those subreddits would praise.

    The implicit desire for honor killings is present, and that's a path we don't want to go down.
    , @Feryl
    I've often said that Whites and East Asians are two sides of the same coin, who basically consider each side to be the same value while not feeling identical to each other.

    But that sentiment isn't exactly reciprocated with other "Caucasian" groups (least of all Southwest Asians), who to some degree evidently don't want a respectful co-existence, or understanding, with whites. I know Derbyshire did a great job explaining this tendency of ethnic groups to become more hostile to each other as they reach greater similarity to each other, though I don't remember his exact explanation for why this happens. E.g., Israeli Jews hate Palestinians, and British Protestants have often been at war with Irish-Catholics, and the stuff between the Chinese and the Japanese. See also "white" Jews in Europe and North America having the greatest enmity toward white gentiles, while almost completely eliding the negative traits of other ethnic groups.

    , @dfordoom

    the idea that Asian men are at white men’s throats is sensationalist, I think.
     
    It comes from thinking that the worlds of college and the media are the whole world. If most Asian college students are SJWs then most Asians must be SJWs. If most Asians in the media are SJWs then most Asians must be SJWs.

    I have no idea what a so-called Arctic Alliance would mean or look like, exactly
     
    The problem with the Arctic Alliance is not that it would be difficult to persuade East Asians to join. The problem is that it would be difficult to persuade white people to join, given that white people don't see themselves as white people. The assumption behind it is that white people are going to adopt racial identity politics. There is no sign whatsoever that that is likely to happen.
  101. @TomSchmidt
    Truth stole my response. There are others. Late in the Obama administration, the average net worth of a black woman was $5. You could Google that one.

    Some people cannot be trusted with debt.

    Conservatives with their “muh free market” and “personal responsibility” don’t get this. Usury is ruinous.

  102. @216
    O/T

    The neo-Victorian "conservative feminism" awakens

    https://twitter.com/MaryJackalope/status/1145768819547201537

    As I predict, we are going to see a lot of this in the coming decade.

    “Not sure how to resolve”

    Understand that men and women are biologically and psychologically different. There you go, dear, you’re all set!

    • Replies: @216
    I don't think women want to accept that, even if they could.

    What they are going to do is:

    -Feminism lied to us
    -Men didn't do their part
    -We need a new feminism that steers men into marriage
    -"Toxic masculinity" meet "failed masculinity"
  103. @Feryl
    The following year, in 1992, a US strategic draft for the post-Cold War period was leaked to the press. The person responsible for the confusion, former Assistant Secretary of State, Paul Wolfowitz, confessed seven years later: "In 1992 a draft memo prepared by my office at the Pentagon ... leaked to the press and sparked a major controversy." The draft's strategy aimed "to prevent any hostile power from dominating" a Eurasian region "whose resources would, under consolidated control, be sufficient to generate global power". He added: "Senator Joseph Biden ridiculed the proposed strategy as 'literally a Pax Americana ... It won't work ...' Just seven years later, many of these same critics seem quite comfortable with the idea of a Pax Americana.

    Looks like somebody needs to ask Joe Biden if America should keep "flexing it's muscle" in order to "advance democracy".

    Tulsi should do it. Biden spends the next month getting ready to dance around the racial bombshells and then, BAM!, a foreign policy sucker punch!

    • Replies: @Feryl
    It's from the Wiki article about Pax American; it's amazing how some corners of the intellectual spectrum collect dust, to the point that the legions of internet "scrubbers" working for the candidates haven't gotten to everything they easily could wipe away. Empire over reach was fashionable as discussion topic in the GW Bush era, but so many painful reminders of our hubris have been desperately hidden away since Obama was elected and ID politics superseded everything else (besides, Obama on economic issues and foreign policy was in many ways to the Right of Reagan, so his embarrassing failure to be a true Progressive has been lost in the PC and ID politics miasma).

    WRT Tulsi, Trump openly savaged the Bush family as failed "world-builders" (globalizers). Tulsi plays things safe by talking about how horrifying it is to lose people for the sake of pointless war, but doesn't generally point out who is calling for war....And why, other than perhaps generic criticisms of war profiteers*. But this elides the haunting question, the spectre, of America as failed (failing?) empire, that no one dares bring up now (unlike how Trump who said that we off-shored to China, kept our borders open, and refused to properly address the real issues of the Middle East; Trump didn't bring up Zionism, but then again, he knew the power of the Zion lobby and I happen to believe that his plan has been to superficially charm the Neo-Cons while limiting the damage they inflict; he knows why Bush is hated and has no desire to follow in his (or LBJ's) footseps because, since Vietnam, the worst thing that can happen to a US president is escalating a protracted war that Americans intuitively know is unnecessary and destabilizing).

    *What's more disturbing than greed is the fact that plenty of American imperialists sincerely believe they are great and entitled to "spread Democracy". I think we have to keep in mind those motivated by money alone often act with some sense of caution and self-preservation, whereas ideologues exhibit no restraint in pursuit of their goals which are motivated by a delusional sense of "good vs evil" (hence, Richard Perle's "End to Evil" book). Real crooks are amoral, not self-deluded by ideology. We have to advance past the fatuous idea that "money" alone is responsible for our horrid and unpopular foreign policy, given that the Pentagon did just fine in the 80's when we weren't actively at war.

    , @Feryl
    Someone really needs to tweet's Biden's sage prophecy to various high level figures (like Carlson, or Tulsi herself). It's astonishing how much more sane our foreign policy was in the 1990's, when we had leaders who still....Led, to some degree.
  104. @216
    O/T

    The neo-Victorian "conservative feminism" awakens

    https://twitter.com/MaryJackalope/status/1145768819547201537

    As I predict, we are going to see a lot of this in the coming decade.

    “I want to have my cake and eat it too but my pea brain is incapable of spinning the necessary rationalization.”

  105. 216 says:
    @Audacious Epigone
    Surveys consistently show the greatest expressed amount of interracial trust and understanding between whites and Asians than between any other major racial pairings. There are resentments, and I have no idea what a so-called Arctic Alliance would mean or look like, exactly, but the idea that Asian men are at white men's throats is sensationalist, I think.

    Ever read r/Hapa or r/AsianMasculinity?

    If you did that would be a logical conclusion, but these are radicalized communties that don’t represent reality.

    The data, ahem, shows that white men are more likely to outmarry than white women; so UFO would be better apt to shame the males that exploit the SMV gradient. Which ironically those subreddits would praise.

    The implicit desire for honor killings is present, and that’s a path we don’t want to go down.

    • Replies: @Audacious Epigone
    I have not, no.
    , @Talha

    The implicit desire for honor killings is present
     
    I’ve seen the posters online; nooses around “Race Mixing Whores”.

    Peace.
    , @Twinkie

    Ever read r/Hapa or r/AsianMasculinity?
     
    I’ve never read them, but I can guess. I assume the same demographic as online WNs, only Asian in ethnicity.

    I doubt they represent the majority of Hapas, let alone Asians.
  106. @Audacious Epigone
    "Not sure how to resolve"

    Understand that men and women are biologically and psychologically different. There you go, dear, you're all set!

    I don’t think women want to accept that, even if they could.

    What they are going to do is:

    -Feminism lied to us
    -Men didn’t do their part
    -We need a new feminism that steers men into marriage
    -“Toxic masculinity” meet “failed masculinity”

    • LOL: iffen
  107. @216
    No matter how right or consistent you might be, this attitude reeks of disrespect and entitlement. I don't think we are going anywhere as political movements when it so easily slips out that even allied figures are to be victims of state power.

    It is simply a white person who is aware of the impending consequences of being a minority (hint: it gets ugly for us).
     
    At the present, we have minimal support from outside, against a large mob of Woke that eagerly await stripping us of privilege. Our image is that of either uneducated hicks, or rich kids unwilling to share.

    And you want to alienate our allies.

    Why not go slut shame some white women?

    I appreciate the sentiment, but I personally don’t mind leaving to a Muslim country if it comes up to a vote and the majority decide such. Not a problem for me, but my wife will be really pissed off (she seems to think she has just as much right as any other White to be here – women, who listens to their husbands these days?).

    The guys that are going to be crying and kicking and screaming are the pozzed ex-Muslims that will literally have their liberal dreams completely shattered:

    Man, that is going to be one wild boat ride to Dar ul-Islam.

    I am concerned about the native converts like the ones I mentioned; they are sons of this land.

    Peace.

  108. @216

    But no – you think what America needs is a few million more east Asians to build “high trust”, Tahla thinks the US needs a few million more muslim Pakistanis, and Thomm thinks the US needs a few million more of his closest H1V Hindu 1st cousins, and Truth want a few trillion more dollars to facilitate all the kids he fathered that he doesn’t know about, while cucks like iffen and Feryl look forward to handing their daughters over to any of them.
     
    You can say that all you want, it might even be true. But untold numbers of people think that White Americans are entitled rich kids getting a lesson in humility.

    Yep, even the Brahmin children of Hindu professionals when they look at dilapidated ghost towns in Appalachia. White privilege!

    • Replies: @216
    Brown savior

    Thats what the South Asians writing in the NYT were expressing, the immigrants are redeeming the failed white racist society.

    Imagine being some Indian doctor working there, it would be hard not to adopt this mentality. Vegetarian Hindus aren't likely to be enthused by rural white Protestants that enjoy hunting.
  109. @Achmed E. Newman
    You sure do like to glean stuff, A.E. ;-}

    Guilty as charged.

  110. @Truth
    Buttigieg is definitely the SWPL candidate of choice. Well educated, highly literate, and he appears to be a respectable gay man married to a husband, and not a creepy degenerate.

    Wow, I guess I'm really not in 1993 anymore.

    He doesn’t ping my gaydar much at all. Is there any controversy about the sincerity of his homosexuality?

    • Replies: @Achmed E. Newman
    Are you implying that you suspect Mr. Buttigieg may be faking being gay to get the Democrat Party nomination? That would take some real boldness and ingenuity. He could go back into the closet the day after the election and truthfully tell everyone that "this guy is just my roommate, seriously. He's gonna stay on an air mattress in the East Wing for a few months ... I owe him that, at least, since I never consummated ...."
    , @Truth
    Im saying; in 1993, i dont think we would have considered a dude who (ostensibly) fucked one dude a "respectable family man", whereas a dude who fucked a bunch of dudea would be "a creepy degenerate."
    , @Feryl
    Some research found that "straight" acting gays tend to have better outcomes in life than the most flaming ones. It could be that "straight" gays are better at "passing", and are treated with more respect, which gives them confidence and they are better able to avoid the nihilist zombie mentality that some gays have.
  111. 216 says:
    @Audacious Epigone
    Yep, even the Brahmin children of Hindu professionals when they look at dilapidated ghost towns in Appalachia. White privilege!

    Brown savior

    Thats what the South Asians writing in the NYT were expressing, the immigrants are redeeming the failed white racist society.

    Imagine being some Indian doctor working there, it would be hard not to adopt this mentality. Vegetarian Hindus aren’t likely to be enthused by rural white Protestants that enjoy hunting.

    • Replies: @Feryl
    Could someone please explain to me what it is about SW Asians that entitles them to inherit the mantle of Progressive thought? The whole thing smacks of opportunism and shamelessness, moreover the globalists who run mainstream Western news certainly like to think of SW Asians as being soldiers of corporate approved wokeness in good standing. Hispanics are too languid, East Asians are too peaceful and timid, and blacks are too unruly (and liable to dis and attack their one time allies).
  112. Anon[412] • Disclaimer says:

    I do not like Kamala Harris’s personality. She is all aggressive “Distict Attorney/bulldog-prosecutor” in demeanor. She is ready to lecture at the drop of a pin on behalf of her excessively complaining coalition of needy (social, financial, easily-offended) would-be voters.

    I think she married who she did to placate powerful interests to get in the White House. Once there however, she might suprise those who would rally behind her with their financial support now. Childless, what she does for -Her- people might be her primary motivation in late middle age.

  113. @Truth



    >Makes a mathematical and statistical post about Dem. candidates polling numbers
     

    I suspect the former president will not. That’s what eight years of loyal service gets Biden–a snub!
     
    Mathematical and statistical analyses generally do not start with "I suspect", although in total transparency, I must admit, I never progressed beyond Trig.

    May I offer a little color commentary from time to time? Please, for my sanity, grant me permission to do so. I’m not a robot, man!

    • Replies: @Truth
    ...Its just that you've set such a high bar, Old Sport.
  114. @Truth
    "Reparations" is just my umbrella term for all of the Al(abaster) Sharpton stuff you guys do about Duh man holdin' you down. As for race-baiting, let's again, examine a part of your post:


    I suspect the former president will not. That’s what eight years of loyal service gets Biden–a snub!
     
    Now ask yourself; "What exactly, does Barry owe Uncle Gropy?" I mean, first of all, it hasn't happened yet, secondly, who gave whom a F- Job.?"

    Unless you were referring to some other reason that Barry would decline to make an endorsement, rather then the one I conjured up out of nowhere in my pea brain, wardrobe, unpaid debts in a card game, whatever, then yes, I would consider this "race baiting."

    I doubt Obama will risk endorsing a white candidate against a non-white candidate while the two are competitive with one another. I’d be happy to be proven wrong, and maybe I will be.

    • Replies: @Truth
    I'm assumimg that he will wait until the election is all but decided before making any primary endorsement. They are, after all, all democrats, and he is, after all, a politician.
    , @Feryl
    Nobody has a clue right now how the Dem race will shake out, and just how bloody the fight is going to get. I don't think it's gonna be pretty; look, Sanders, Warren etc. are all Sixties Generation people trying as much as possible to dispel the notion that the "soft centrism" of the 1990's ever did anything good for society. Moderation and calm are out; way way way out.

    I don't think Obama wants to jeopardize his Saint-like image by siding with a candidate earlier on, and risking accusations that he's trying to sabotage the ideology represented by that candidate. He's going to play it safe, and probably not wade in until well into the race at which time most of the candidate's will have dropped out and their supporters will be too exhausted to complain about Obama.
  115. 216 says:
    @UrbaneFrancoOntarian
    I am neither disrespectful nor entitled. I'm simply neutral and stating facts on the question of race. Non-whites are alien to me and therefore we should be separate. Seems like a pretty simple concept to me.

    Our image is that of either uneducated hicks, or rich kids unwilling to share.
     
    Anybody with an IQ of over 90 could see that those are two polar opposite assumptions. Simultaneously rich privileged kids and white trash rednecks at the same time. However, the brown peoples are not know for their intelligence; therefore whatever narrative is convenient at a given time is what they will be angry about.

    You are all about playing *within* their rules. But you don't seem to realize that you're meant to lose that game. Same as the Republicans and conservatives "conserving" so much since the 1950s. When you play within their paradigm, you lose. That's why I'm making bold statements.

    I am neither disrespectful nor entitled.

    It does not matter what you think, it matters what the press and their Woke followers think.

    You are all about playing *within* their rules. But you don’t seem to realize that you’re meant to lose that game.

    I suggest not playing at all. Our very presence causes emotional torment to leftists and PeeOhCee, which fuels the cycle of radicalization. So we have to go underground, disaffiliate with mainstream society, stop using Big Social, etc.

    Anybody with an IQ of over 90 could see that those are two polar opposite assumptions.

    Higher IQ are perfectly capable of rationalizing doublethink in the pursuit of victory. And fwiw, there were spoiled rich kids at Charlottesville, and uneducated hicks.

  116. @216
    Ever read r/Hapa or r/AsianMasculinity?

    If you did that would be a logical conclusion, but these are radicalized communties that don't represent reality.

    The data, ahem, shows that white men are more likely to outmarry than white women; so UFO would be better apt to shame the males that exploit the SMV gradient. Which ironically those subreddits would praise.

    The implicit desire for honor killings is present, and that's a path we don't want to go down.

    I have not, no.

  117. 216 says:
    @UrbaneFrancoOntarian
    They see white trash, which they resent and want to obliterate. They have been looking down on their own through the caste system for centuries.

    "White privilege" is just a tool for them to take more from whitey. They will bitch about your white privilege while killing you and taking your money, without even blinking or thinking.

    Indians will speak out both sides of their mouths. Opposing statements fly out in a matter of minutes. Never trust one.

    They see white trash, which they resent and want to obliterate

    White liberals consider it of vital importance to tone and speech police the politics of the middle class, which then filters down to the underclass.

    WN consider it of low importance that whites are routinely outperformed by Asians on many social indicators. This should be considered shameful. But they only want to blame external causes, which are politically inviolate and thus unfixable.

    Indians will speak out both sides of their mouths.

    White+Indian= ~white

    Maybe Bengali can introduce you to eligible females.

    • Replies: @MikeatMikedotMike
    "WN consider it of low importance that whites are routinely outperformed by Asians on many social indicators."

    And if you were half a honest as you think you are you'd concede that your point, however true or not, is irrelevant to the fact that whites have as much right as any other ethnic or racial group to their own nation, separate from all these "better people" who can't seem to help their need to be as close to whites as possible.
  118. @UrbaneFrancoOntarian
    They see white trash, which they resent and want to obliterate. They have been looking down on their own through the caste system for centuries.

    "White privilege" is just a tool for them to take more from whitey. They will bitch about your white privilege while killing you and taking your money, without even blinking or thinking.

    Indians will speak out both sides of their mouths. Opposing statements fly out in a matter of minutes. Never trust one.

    You’re young so your zealotry is understandable, but it’s rhetorically disastrous.

    If you’ve paid attention to my comments/posts over even just the last several months, you’ll know I’m an enormous admirer of Razib Khan (he was actually born in Bangladesh but that’s not important here), I’ve known him for over a decade, and I would absolutely trust him with anything no matter how sensitive.

    So when you write “never trust one”, I’m going to dismiss everything else you assert on account of that advice being in total diametric opposition to my personal experience.

    • Agree: 216
    • Replies: @Feryl
    Neil Howe recently said that Boomers (and late Silents) were split on the '72 election between Nixon and McGovern, however over 35 voters absolutely crushed McGovern, and Nixon won in a landslide. Give us some high-profile incidents of frenzied blacks attacking and terrorizing Hispanics/Asians/elderly white women, and the 2020 election could be a woke wipe out; nobody wanted the New Left in power in 1972, when riots, bombings, and youthful radicalism were on the rise. In this more partisan era, you just won't pry as many away from the Dems these days, regardless of how idiotic the party's standard bearer is acting. That being said, the largely youthful radicalism you are preaching against is going to be seen as "square" by today's youngsters, who had mostly Gen X parents and didn't grow up hearing about Kent State et al.

    It's the fathers and sons theory; Gen X was individualistic and hated Silent and Boomer political blathering; Gen Z is hive-minded, and didn't grow up with parents blathering about politics. About 70 years after 1970, and in the 70 years between the birth of Silents in 1925 and the birth of Gen Z in 1996, we are now at the point of another flash-point of political unrest; how bad it gets depends on the reaction of older people; older people were horrified by the late 60's, will older people be horrified by the 2020's? We'll see.
  119. @216
    Ever read r/Hapa or r/AsianMasculinity?

    If you did that would be a logical conclusion, but these are radicalized communties that don't represent reality.

    The data, ahem, shows that white men are more likely to outmarry than white women; so UFO would be better apt to shame the males that exploit the SMV gradient. Which ironically those subreddits would praise.

    The implicit desire for honor killings is present, and that's a path we don't want to go down.

    The implicit desire for honor killings is present

    I’ve seen the posters online; nooses around “Race Mixing Whores”.

    Peace.

    • Replies: @216
    Not going to dive in for the data, but I recall that in the UK, 95% of Pakistani married within same group. About 90% of white marry white in the US, with the largest group being Hispanic. Presumably in Pakistan itself the number is 99%.

    So as a countercultural group, 95% is the most possible in a liberal society with considerable deference given from the authorities.

    This is the problem of the fusion of Incel rage with White Nationalism. It's like people are pointing a target on their basement for the drone strike.
  120. 216 says:
    @Talha

    The implicit desire for honor killings is present
     
    I’ve seen the posters online; nooses around “Race Mixing Whores”.

    Peace.

    Not going to dive in for the data, but I recall that in the UK, 95% of Pakistani married within same group. About 90% of white marry white in the US, with the largest group being Hispanic. Presumably in Pakistan itself the number is 99%.

    So as a countercultural group, 95% is the most possible in a liberal society with considerable deference given from the authorities.

    This is the problem of the fusion of Incel rage with White Nationalism. It’s like people are pointing a target on their basement for the drone strike.

    • Replies: @Talha
    And it will happen, trust me. It will take literally a week of emergency legislation to have each one of us tracked by smart phones, GPS, triangulation by IP. My phone does facial recognition of people in my photos and I never even asked for it. The technology is all there already (my team did some phone development using an intermediary API called Cordova which is open source - you think they don’t have a proprietary or secret API that others don’t know about that exposes phone functionality that others can’t normally access), all they would need to do is give the order for the backdoor to be opened and none of the big businesses would stand in their way - hell, they’d be on board cheering them on. Evidence? Yeah we have video:
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=

    “Waterboarding? Why we would only do that to Arabs.”

    Pfffshwahahahaha - yeah right!

    Peace.

  121. @Audacious Epigone
    He doesn't ping my gaydar much at all. Is there any controversy about the sincerity of his homosexuality?

    Are you implying that you suspect Mr. Buttigieg may be faking being gay to get the Democrat Party nomination? That would take some real boldness and ingenuity. He could go back into the closet the day after the election and truthfully tell everyone that “this guy is just my roommate, seriously. He’s gonna stay on an air mattress in the East Wing for a few months … I owe him that, at least, since I never consummated ….”

    • Replies: @Audacious Epigone
    No, implying is much too strong a characterization--more like I'm wondering why there is no conspiracy around it.
  122. @216
    Not going to dive in for the data, but I recall that in the UK, 95% of Pakistani married within same group. About 90% of white marry white in the US, with the largest group being Hispanic. Presumably in Pakistan itself the number is 99%.

    So as a countercultural group, 95% is the most possible in a liberal society with considerable deference given from the authorities.

    This is the problem of the fusion of Incel rage with White Nationalism. It's like people are pointing a target on their basement for the drone strike.

    And it will happen, trust me. It will take literally a week of emergency legislation to have each one of us tracked by smart phones, GPS, triangulation by IP. My phone does facial recognition of people in my photos and I never even asked for it. The technology is all there already (my team did some phone development using an intermediary API called Cordova which is open source – you think they don’t have a proprietary or secret API that others don’t know about that exposes phone functionality that others can’t normally access), all they would need to do is give the order for the backdoor to be opened and none of the big businesses would stand in their way – hell, they’d be on board cheering them on. Evidence? Yeah we have video:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=

    “Waterboarding? Why we would only do that to Arabs.”

    Pfffshwahahahaha – yeah right!

    Peace.

  123. @216

    But no – you think what America needs is a few million more east Asians to build “high trust”, Tahla thinks the US needs a few million more muslim Pakistanis, and Thomm thinks the US needs a few million more of his closest H1V Hindu 1st cousins, and Truth want a few trillion more dollars to facilitate all the kids he fathered that he doesn’t know about, while cucks like iffen and Feryl look forward to handing their daughters over to any of them.
     
    You can say that all you want, it might even be true. But untold numbers of people think that White Americans are entitled rich kids getting a lesson in humility.

    “But untold numbers of people think that White Americans are entitled rich kids getting a lesson in humility.”

    And YOU can believe that steaming pile of horseshit all you want. Envy is no less a sin than pride. And we’re going to see who learns a lesson when the shooting starts.

    • Replies: @216
    Is it Envy on my part?

    I don't think so.

    Envy is their path, I am encouraging us to act with Charity. People will not stop coming to the First World unless they are given a carrot to accompany the stick. Our people forget that.
  124. @216

    They see white trash, which they resent and want to obliterate
     
    White liberals consider it of vital importance to tone and speech police the politics of the middle class, which then filters down to the underclass.

    WN consider it of low importance that whites are routinely outperformed by Asians on many social indicators. This should be considered shameful. But they only want to blame external causes, which are politically inviolate and thus unfixable.

    Indians will speak out both sides of their mouths.
     
    White+Indian= ~white

    Maybe Bengali can introduce you to eligible females.

    “WN consider it of low importance that whites are routinely outperformed by Asians on many social indicators.”

    And if you were half a honest as you think you are you’d concede that your point, however true or not, is irrelevant to the fact that whites have as much right as any other ethnic or racial group to their own nation, separate from all these “better people” who can’t seem to help their need to be as close to whites as possible.

    • Agree: Mr. Rational
    • Replies: @216

    And if you were half a honest as you think you are you’d concede that your point, however true or not, is irrelevant to the fact that whites have as much right as any other ethnic or racial group to their own nation, separate from all these “better people” who can’t seem to help their need to be as close to whites as possible.
     
    The enemy does not concede the point that we are entitled to self-determination. Rather, they agitate for increasing dilution of national sovereignty through multi-lateral, supra-national and non-governmental organizations.

    At best, the enemy concedes a marginal right to privacy in your own thoughts, free of the torment of others. There is a distinction between the contempt of the elite, versus the envy of the masses. The elite oppose us with a religious ferocity.

    As a moral point, we should encourage excellence. If Asians are beating Whites, then whites need to find ways of meeting and beating the Asian standard. There is no excuse for whites abusing drugs and committing crime at higher rates than Asians. Nor is there an excuse for the higher obesity of whites.
    , @iffen
    whites have as much right as any other ethnic or racial group to their own nation

    I've never said that you WNs don't have that right. I just say that you can't have mine.
  125. @Audacious Epigone
    He doesn't ping my gaydar much at all. Is there any controversy about the sincerity of his homosexuality?

    Im saying; in 1993, i dont think we would have considered a dude who (ostensibly) fucked one dude a “respectable family man”, whereas a dude who fucked a bunch of dudea would be “a creepy degenerate.”

  126. @Audacious Epigone
    Tulsi should do it. Biden spends the next month getting ready to dance around the racial bombshells and then, BAM!, a foreign policy sucker punch!

    It’s from the Wiki article about Pax American; it’s amazing how some corners of the intellectual spectrum collect dust, to the point that the legions of internet “scrubbers” working for the candidates haven’t gotten to everything they easily could wipe away. Empire over reach was fashionable as discussion topic in the GW Bush era, but so many painful reminders of our hubris have been desperately hidden away since Obama was elected and ID politics superseded everything else (besides, Obama on economic issues and foreign policy was in many ways to the Right of Reagan, so his embarrassing failure to be a true Progressive has been lost in the PC and ID politics miasma).

    WRT Tulsi, Trump openly savaged the Bush family as failed “world-builders” (globalizers). Tulsi plays things safe by talking about how horrifying it is to lose people for the sake of pointless war, but doesn’t generally point out who is calling for war….And why, other than perhaps generic criticisms of war profiteers*. But this elides the haunting question, the spectre, of America as failed (failing?) empire, that no one dares bring up now (unlike how Trump who said that we off-shored to China, kept our borders open, and refused to properly address the real issues of the Middle East; Trump didn’t bring up Zionism, but then again, he knew the power of the Zion lobby and I happen to believe that his plan has been to superficially charm the Neo-Cons while limiting the damage they inflict; he knows why Bush is hated and has no desire to follow in his (or LBJ’s) footseps because, since Vietnam, the worst thing that can happen to a US president is escalating a protracted war that Americans intuitively know is unnecessary and destabilizing).

    *What’s more disturbing than greed is the fact that plenty of American imperialists sincerely believe they are great and entitled to “spread Democracy”. I think we have to keep in mind those motivated by money alone often act with some sense of caution and self-preservation, whereas ideologues exhibit no restraint in pursuit of their goals which are motivated by a delusional sense of “good vs evil” (hence, Richard Perle’s “End to Evil” book). Real crooks are amoral, not self-deluded by ideology. We have to advance past the fatuous idea that “money” alone is responsible for our horrid and unpopular foreign policy, given that the Pentagon did just fine in the 80’s when we weren’t actively at war.

  127. @Audacious Epigone
    May I offer a little color commentary from time to time? Please, for my sanity, grant me permission to do so. I'm not a robot, man!

    …Its just that you’ve set such a high bar, Old Sport.

    • Replies: @Audacious Epigone
    Off with the sarcasm!
  128. @MikeatMikedotMike
    "But untold numbers of people think that White Americans are entitled rich kids getting a lesson in humility."

    And YOU can believe that steaming pile of horseshit all you want. Envy is no less a sin than pride. And we're going to see who learns a lesson when the shooting starts.

    Is it Envy on my part?

    I don’t think so.

    Envy is their path, I am encouraging us to act with Charity. People will not stop coming to the First World unless they are given a carrot to accompany the stick. Our people forget that.

    • Replies: @Mr. Rational

    People will not stop coming to the First World unless they are given a carrot to accompany the stick.
     
    They'll stop coming when we stop letting them in, and punish them for coming here illegally.  People can and will be charitable, but we don't owe them anything.

    If they're our equals or even superiors, let them build nice countries like the one we made and they want to come to instead of doing the hard work themselves.  If they're our inferiors, they have no business being here period.
  129. @Audacious Epigone
    I doubt Obama will risk endorsing a white candidate against a non-white candidate while the two are competitive with one another. I'd be happy to be proven wrong, and maybe I will be.

    I’m assumimg that he will wait until the election is all but decided before making any primary endorsement. They are, after all, all democrats, and he is, after all, a politician.

  130. @Audacious Epigone
    Tulsi should do it. Biden spends the next month getting ready to dance around the racial bombshells and then, BAM!, a foreign policy sucker punch!

    Someone really needs to tweet’s Biden’s sage prophecy to various high level figures (like Carlson, or Tulsi herself). It’s astonishing how much more sane our foreign policy was in the 1990’s, when we had leaders who still….Led, to some degree.

  131. 216 says:
    @MikeatMikedotMike
    "WN consider it of low importance that whites are routinely outperformed by Asians on many social indicators."

    And if you were half a honest as you think you are you'd concede that your point, however true or not, is irrelevant to the fact that whites have as much right as any other ethnic or racial group to their own nation, separate from all these "better people" who can't seem to help their need to be as close to whites as possible.

    And if you were half a honest as you think you are you’d concede that your point, however true or not, is irrelevant to the fact that whites have as much right as any other ethnic or racial group to their own nation, separate from all these “better people” who can’t seem to help their need to be as close to whites as possible.

    The enemy does not concede the point that we are entitled to self-determination. Rather, they agitate for increasing dilution of national sovereignty through multi-lateral, supra-national and non-governmental organizations.

    At best, the enemy concedes a marginal right to privacy in your own thoughts, free of the torment of others. There is a distinction between the contempt of the elite, versus the envy of the masses. The elite oppose us with a religious ferocity.

    As a moral point, we should encourage excellence. If Asians are beating Whites, then whites need to find ways of meeting and beating the Asian standard. There is no excuse for whites abusing drugs and committing crime at higher rates than Asians. Nor is there an excuse for the higher obesity of whites.

    • Replies: @Feryl

    As a moral point, we should encourage excellence. If Asians are beating Whites, then whites need to find ways of meeting and beating the Asian standard. There is no excuse for whites abusing drugs and committing crime at higher rates than Asians. Nor is there an excuse for the higher obesity of whites.
     
    Whites went from creating the finest society in human history, in the 1940's-1960's, to looking the other way at porno shops selling kitty pron in the late 1970's. There just is no getting around the fact that whites get bored easily, and lack gratitude for the accomplishments of their elders*. That creates a "fluid" or "dynamic" society, but it also leads to valuable tools and knowledge being squandered for decades. For all the beautiful and creative things whites do, they can also be incredibly selfish, head-strong, and decadent.

    *This isn't necessarily a bad thing when your elders ain't that great.
    , @MikeatMikedotMike
    " If Asians are beating Whites, then whites need to find ways of meeting and beating the Asian standard. "

    Not necessary with separate nations. When the US was 85% white, it was dong fine in comparison to China.

    "There is no excuse for whites abusing drugs and committing crime at higher rates than Asians. Nor is there an excuse for the higher obesity of whites."

    LOL - yeah let's just throw causality out the window! Let's just look at the result without examining the process! White criminality, obesity and drug abuse were fractions of what they are now before the 1960's. Gee, I wonder what changed??? I mean besides just about everything?

    Similarly, by your logic there is no excuse for North Koreans to not be thriving equally to their South Koreans relatives.
  132. @Audacious Epigone
    There isn't an obvious corollary to Biden in 2008 for Harris in 2016. She might pick Buttigieg, but he's an attempted sop to flyover America, not the steady and staid hand of a grizzled political veteran. On the other hand, America in 2020 will be substantially different from America in 2008.

    The more lethal picks for VP that Harris could make is either Sen. Bob Casey or Gov. Tom Wolf both of Pennsylvania.

    • Replies: @Justvisiting
    Yup.

    Harris just needs a white cuck as VP. They are a dime a dozen...
  133. @Audacious Epigone
    Tulsi tried. Here's to her continuing to try.

    But she's elegant, composed, and pretty, yet the reaction to her is a big yawn.

    But populism, the real kind, is too radioactive right now to the Dem base. They want “minority” populism (ya know, only a minority of morons thinks that free college and open borders is a great idea, and stuff like reparations is guaranteed to win approval from self-appointed guardians of “minorities” while alienating everyone else).

    It’s ID politics or bust; not only are Dems disinterested in populism, at the moment, but even comfy centrism appears to be on the way out (were this not the case, then Biden and Buttigieg would be doing better, and Sanders would be badly fading; Sanders is still hanging on to some degree, and no amount of “anointing” from the mainstream/Dem establishment is going to propel Biden).

    There was a thought (hope?) that the Dem race would be about the base encouraging a “moderate”/Centrist who could capably take on Trump in the heartland. But those designs have been foiled by the early debates, which became a massive Wokefest that raised the blood pressure of all but the most die-hard ID politics devotees. The base, and the candidates trying to stay in touch with it, are all competing to see who can dis the heartland normies the most. They may not literally say “basket of deplorables”, but their supposed policy stances say the same thing. “Purity” (and “virtue”) over pragmatism. Like the GOP running a social Darwinist in 1948, or something, to send the message that they weren’t being corrupted by New Dealism.

    • Replies: @Audacious Epigone
    Great point regarding not literally talking about deplorables but clearly taking digs at them again and again and again. And this is only the first debate, with ten people each--the claws will sink in deeper in future debates when the field narrows.
  134. @UrbaneFrancoOntarian
    They see white trash, which they resent and want to obliterate. They have been looking down on their own through the caste system for centuries.

    "White privilege" is just a tool for them to take more from whitey. They will bitch about your white privilege while killing you and taking your money, without even blinking or thinking.

    Indians will speak out both sides of their mouths. Opposing statements fly out in a matter of minutes. Never trust one.

    Yo, Brother Daniel got back to me and wants your specific feedback on what can be improved on the muslimskeptic.com website.

    Also, I know the comments section at Unz rocks, but it’s all custom code, so do you have another site you would recommend as a good example of a comments section?

    Peace.

  135. @Audacious Epigone
    I doubt Obama will risk endorsing a white candidate against a non-white candidate while the two are competitive with one another. I'd be happy to be proven wrong, and maybe I will be.

    Nobody has a clue right now how the Dem race will shake out, and just how bloody the fight is going to get. I don’t think it’s gonna be pretty; look, Sanders, Warren etc. are all Sixties Generation people trying as much as possible to dispel the notion that the “soft centrism” of the 1990’s ever did anything good for society. Moderation and calm are out; way way way out.

    I don’t think Obama wants to jeopardize his Saint-like image by siding with a candidate earlier on, and risking accusations that he’s trying to sabotage the ideology represented by that candidate. He’s going to play it safe, and probably not wade in until well into the race at which time most of the candidate’s will have dropped out and their supporters will be too exhausted to complain about Obama.

  136. @216

    And if you were half a honest as you think you are you’d concede that your point, however true or not, is irrelevant to the fact that whites have as much right as any other ethnic or racial group to their own nation, separate from all these “better people” who can’t seem to help their need to be as close to whites as possible.
     
    The enemy does not concede the point that we are entitled to self-determination. Rather, they agitate for increasing dilution of national sovereignty through multi-lateral, supra-national and non-governmental organizations.

    At best, the enemy concedes a marginal right to privacy in your own thoughts, free of the torment of others. There is a distinction between the contempt of the elite, versus the envy of the masses. The elite oppose us with a religious ferocity.

    As a moral point, we should encourage excellence. If Asians are beating Whites, then whites need to find ways of meeting and beating the Asian standard. There is no excuse for whites abusing drugs and committing crime at higher rates than Asians. Nor is there an excuse for the higher obesity of whites.

    As a moral point, we should encourage excellence. If Asians are beating Whites, then whites need to find ways of meeting and beating the Asian standard. There is no excuse for whites abusing drugs and committing crime at higher rates than Asians. Nor is there an excuse for the higher obesity of whites.

    Whites went from creating the finest society in human history, in the 1940’s-1960’s, to looking the other way at porno shops selling kitty pron in the late 1970’s. There just is no getting around the fact that whites get bored easily, and lack gratitude for the accomplishments of their elders*. That creates a “fluid” or “dynamic” society, but it also leads to valuable tools and knowledge being squandered for decades. For all the beautiful and creative things whites do, they can also be incredibly selfish, head-strong, and decadent.

    *This isn’t necessarily a bad thing when your elders ain’t that great.

  137. @MikeatMikedotMike
    "White nationalism is a symptom of our nation’s current malaise, it is neither the cause nor a solution."

    So called white nationalism is a symptom of an ever increasing non white population infesting the United States, making demands for access to whites' wealth and or power and or communities.

    If the non white population of the US were under 10%, there would be no white nationalism, because it wouldn't be necessary.


    But no - you think what America needs is a few million more east Asians to build "high trust", Tahla thinks the US needs a few million more muslim Pakistanis, and Thomm thinks the US needs a few million more of his closest H1V Hindu 1st cousins, and Truth want a few trillion more dollars to facilitate all the kids he fathered that he doesn't know about, while cucks like iffen and Feryl look forward to handing their daughters over to any of them.

    And then you want to slander whites as "white nationalists" (read: racist) for daring to notice the walls closing in on the people who built the country to begin with.

    you think what America needs is a few million more east Asians to build “high trust”

    I’m an immigration restrictionist, including that from Asia.

    • Replies: @Talha
    You’d think people might actually pay attention to our thousands of comments in a easily searchable history...

    Peace.
    , @MikeatMikedotMike
    "I’m an immigration restrictionist, including that from Asia."

    "Restrictionist." So I guess you don't think the entire world should come here. Otherwise, that term is useless because it can be applied relatively. 100 million want to come, but I only allowed 10 million to enter. See? I'm a restrictionist!

    I'm an immigration abolishist. The US does not need, nor can it afford, a single additional individual, from anywhere.
  138. @Audacious Epigone
    You're young so your zealotry is understandable, but it's rhetorically disastrous.

    If you've paid attention to my comments/posts over even just the last several months, you'll know I'm an enormous admirer of Razib Khan (he was actually born in Bangladesh but that's not important here), I've known him for over a decade, and I would absolutely trust him with anything no matter how sensitive.

    So when you write "never trust one", I'm going to dismiss everything else you assert on account of that advice being in total diametric opposition to my personal experience.

    Neil Howe recently said that Boomers (and late Silents) were split on the ’72 election between Nixon and McGovern, however over 35 voters absolutely crushed McGovern, and Nixon won in a landslide. Give us some high-profile incidents of frenzied blacks attacking and terrorizing Hispanics/Asians/elderly white women, and the 2020 election could be a woke wipe out; nobody wanted the New Left in power in 1972, when riots, bombings, and youthful radicalism were on the rise. In this more partisan era, you just won’t pry as many away from the Dems these days, regardless of how idiotic the party’s standard bearer is acting. That being said, the largely youthful radicalism you are preaching against is going to be seen as “square” by today’s youngsters, who had mostly Gen X parents and didn’t grow up hearing about Kent State et al.

    It’s the fathers and sons theory; Gen X was individualistic and hated Silent and Boomer political blathering; Gen Z is hive-minded, and didn’t grow up with parents blathering about politics. About 70 years after 1970, and in the 70 years between the birth of Silents in 1925 and the birth of Gen Z in 1996, we are now at the point of another flash-point of political unrest; how bad it gets depends on the reaction of older people; older people were horrified by the late 60’s, will older people be horrified by the 2020’s? We’ll see.

  139. @216
    Ever read r/Hapa or r/AsianMasculinity?

    If you did that would be a logical conclusion, but these are radicalized communties that don't represent reality.

    The data, ahem, shows that white men are more likely to outmarry than white women; so UFO would be better apt to shame the males that exploit the SMV gradient. Which ironically those subreddits would praise.

    The implicit desire for honor killings is present, and that's a path we don't want to go down.

    Ever read r/Hapa or r/AsianMasculinity?

    I’ve never read them, but I can guess. I assume the same demographic as online WNs, only Asian in ethnicity.

    I doubt they represent the majority of Hapas, let alone Asians.

  140. @Twinkie

    you think what America needs is a few million more east Asians to build “high trust”
     
    I’m an immigration restrictionist, including that from Asia.

    You’d think people might actually pay attention to our thousands of comments in a easily searchable history…

    Peace.

  141. @UrbaneFrancoOntarian
    Yup.

    Especially agree with the shout out to Twinkie and Talha. They are good people, sure. But they have to go back since they're racial aliens.

    Furthermore, watch how defensive Twinkie gets when it comes to anything Asian vs. Whites. He's no different from any other Asian, ultra thin skinned and sensitive when it comes to his own race.

    "White nationalism" is literally just a white person with common sense around race. White advocate, white supremacist, doesnt matter. It is simply a white person who is aware of the impending consequences of being a minority (hint: it gets ugly for us).

    But they have to go back since they’re racial aliens.

    Try it, and you will eat lots of bullets from my wife’s clan.

    Furthermore, watch how defensive Twinkie gets when it comes to anything Asian vs. Whites. He’s no different from any other Asian, ultra thin skinned and sensitive when it comes to his own race.

    You still sore, because I said that whites are not the best at everything? Stop projecting your insecurity. I am happy with my own, personal accomplishments – I don’t need to tout my race to feel better.

  142. @Audacious Epigone
    Surveys consistently show the greatest expressed amount of interracial trust and understanding between whites and Asians than between any other major racial pairings. There are resentments, and I have no idea what a so-called Arctic Alliance would mean or look like, exactly, but the idea that Asian men are at white men's throats is sensationalist, I think.

    I’ve often said that Whites and East Asians are two sides of the same coin, who basically consider each side to be the same value while not feeling identical to each other.

    But that sentiment isn’t exactly reciprocated with other “Caucasian” groups (least of all Southwest Asians), who to some degree evidently don’t want a respectful co-existence, or understanding, with whites. I know Derbyshire did a great job explaining this tendency of ethnic groups to become more hostile to each other as they reach greater similarity to each other, though I don’t remember his exact explanation for why this happens. E.g., Israeli Jews hate Palestinians, and British Protestants have often been at war with Irish-Catholics, and the stuff between the Chinese and the Japanese. See also “white” Jews in Europe and North America having the greatest enmity toward white gentiles, while almost completely eliding the negative traits of other ethnic groups.

    • Agree: Sid
    • Replies: @SFG
    Occupying the same ecological niche, perhaps? Jews and blacks seem to get along pretty well. Still, in some cases they mesh instead of clashing--there are a lot of (pick 2 of 3) Jewish-Asian-gentile white hybrids floating around the Northeastern upper middle class these days. Not sure why one happens and not the other.

    Didn't AE show Jewish antigentilism was more of an elite phenomenon than a generally distributed one, a while ago?

  143. @Truth



    They are fellow Americans who feel alienated and marginalized.
    The correct solution is to address their concerns and, where there is common interest (and there is), achieve the goals of those shared interests.
     
    Wow! you know, I agree with you Twinx, and I feel that there are other groups who fit this description, although I can't think of whom they are right now...

    I feel that there are other groups who fit this description, although I can’t think of whom they are right now…

    Go bark up another tree. I’ve written time and again that I want fulfillment and dignity for all my fellow Americans, including, yes, blacks – at minimum, because our fates are tied. Black problems eventually become those for other Americans sooner or later.

    I want blacks to do better than they have in the past, but that doesn’t mean I think they are capable of achieving the same level of prosperity as other groups. I don’t believe in “closing the gap” – I believe in people doing as best as they can, realistically. Not everyone is born with the same abilities, whether as individuals or as groups.

    • Replies: @Feryl
    As America becomes Brazil El Norte, blacks will become an embarrassing headache that most people consign to the bottom of the heap without much thought. No longer will they be the default "victim" of a dreadful past from which they can't escape. Old-school racial narratives just don't apply to America anymore. As of right now, Hispanics now outnumber blacks in this country.

    Whether people publicly admit it or not, they are tired of blacks bitching about everything, and preying on people, and would much rather deal with bookish Asians and taciturn Mexicans. I know that some Boomers make the (goofy and overly sentimental) case that various ethnic groups are supposed to be so disagreeable that they want everything about the demographics of 1970 to come back*, even if it evidently means tolerating vast sections of NYC and Los Angeles being no-go wastelands due to the menacing and surly blacks.

    *Various white generations are to some degree flawed in their outlook and even behavior, but that being said, they still don't cause as much trouble as blacks; whites look back at decades like the 1920's and 1970's with shame and embarrassment, and consider them well out-side the norm of white values and mainly caused by particularly reckless generations (the Lost Generation, and the Boomer Generation).
    , @Truth
    That's a good, measured, and logical response Big Twinx.

    ...I was referring to Menonites, but it's nice knowing how you feel about those black people.
  144. @216
    Brown savior

    Thats what the South Asians writing in the NYT were expressing, the immigrants are redeeming the failed white racist society.

    Imagine being some Indian doctor working there, it would be hard not to adopt this mentality. Vegetarian Hindus aren't likely to be enthused by rural white Protestants that enjoy hunting.

    Could someone please explain to me what it is about SW Asians that entitles them to inherit the mantle of Progressive thought? The whole thing smacks of opportunism and shamelessness, moreover the globalists who run mainstream Western news certainly like to think of SW Asians as being soldiers of corporate approved wokeness in good standing. Hispanics are too languid, East Asians are too peaceful and timid, and blacks are too unruly (and liable to dis and attack their one time allies).

    • Replies: @Toronto Russian

    Could someone please explain to me what it is about SW Asians that entitles them to inherit the mantle of Progressive thought?
     
    They're influenced by the ugliness of ultra conservatism back home? This was a successful 2017 movie, apparently based on what's really happening there:

    Keshav (Akshay Kumar) has to marry a black buffalo because his father (Panditji) is a very religious and superstitious priest, and he believes that his son's marriage to a black buffalo will help improve Keshav's fortune.

    Keshav meets Jaya (Bhumi Pednekar), an educated college going girl, falls in love with her and eventually convinces her to marry him. However, Keshav's father is of the view that Keshav's horoscope is such that he can and should only marry a girl who has two thumbs on her left hand. Since Jaya does not fulfill this requirement, Keshav has an artificial thumb made and gives it to Jaya who wears it as a ring on her thumb. Keshav's unsuspecting father agrees to their marriage.
    (...)
    After a futile attempt to convince his sarpanch and villagers to build toilets in the village, Keshav, with the help of Jaya, contacts the concerned regulatory authority and starts the construction of a toilet in his front yard. When the construction is finished, Keshav's father and the sarpanch arrange to demolish the toilet while Keshav is still asleep. But Keshav wakes up before the toilet is completely destroyed and protects it from complete demolition.

    Jaya now files for a divorce in the local court citing the unavailability of a toilet in her husband's house as the primary reason for seeking a divorce. Due to its unique nature, the case gets a lot of media attention. Politicians and the concerned government departments spring into action to hasten the process of constructing toilets in Keshav's village. But Keshav's father remains steadfast on his decision to not have a toilet in his house, until one day, his mother, while going out to defecate, falls on the doorstep, injures her hip and cries vehemently that she can't possibly walk to the fields to defecate, and that she must use the toilet that Keshav constructed in the front yard. After much reluctance, Keshav's father gives in and helps his mother to the toilet. He then realises that a toilet is indeed a critical requirement within a household.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toilet:_Ek_Prem_Katha
     

    , @Audacious Epigone
    The answer to the question is contained within it. They know how to play the game exceptionally well. They were oppressors where they come from because that's the way to the top on the subcontinent, and they're oppressed here because that's the way to the top in the Western world.
  145. @iffen
    while cucks like iffen

    Time out, Twinkie.

    I am not a cuck, you ignorant cocksucker. I said that you were in over your head. I was wrong. You are in over your boot tops. Of all the ignorant dipwad WNs that comment here, you are one of the least intelligent. Not that I hold that against you, your low IQ being out of your control.

    LOL – you’re the biggest cuck on Ae’s comment section. Go cry to your negro co-workers about it.

    • Replies: @iffen
    LOL – you’re the biggest cuck on Ae’s comment section.

    And you are the biggest dimwit. I am decidedly not a conservative. I would tell you to find a comment where I claim to be a conservative, but you couldn't find it even if it was there. You are one of these idiots that think you can change the definition of a word all by yourself.
  146. @Twinkie

    I feel that there are other groups who fit this description, although I can’t think of whom they are right now…
     
    Go bark up another tree. I’ve written time and again that I want fulfillment and dignity for all my fellow Americans, including, yes, blacks - at minimum, because our fates are tied. Black problems eventually become those for other Americans sooner or later.

    I want blacks to do better than they have in the past, but that doesn’t mean I think they are capable of achieving the same level of prosperity as other groups. I don’t believe in “closing the gap” - I believe in people doing as best as they can, realistically. Not everyone is born with the same abilities, whether as individuals or as groups.

    As America becomes Brazil El Norte, blacks will become an embarrassing headache that most people consign to the bottom of the heap without much thought. No longer will they be the default “victim” of a dreadful past from which they can’t escape. Old-school racial narratives just don’t apply to America anymore. As of right now, Hispanics now outnumber blacks in this country.

    Whether people publicly admit it or not, they are tired of blacks bitching about everything, and preying on people, and would much rather deal with bookish Asians and taciturn Mexicans. I know that some Boomers make the (goofy and overly sentimental) case that various ethnic groups are supposed to be so disagreeable that they want everything about the demographics of 1970 to come back*, even if it evidently means tolerating vast sections of NYC and Los Angeles being no-go wastelands due to the menacing and surly blacks.

    *Various white generations are to some degree flawed in their outlook and even behavior, but that being said, they still don’t cause as much trouble as blacks; whites look back at decades like the 1920’s and 1970’s with shame and embarrassment, and consider them well out-side the norm of white values and mainly caused by particularly reckless generations (the Lost Generation, and the Boomer Generation).

    • Replies: @Truth
    I guess the operative question a man a man in your position must ask, Feral, is "will it happen while I am alive?"
  147. @Audacious Epigone
    He doesn't ping my gaydar much at all. Is there any controversy about the sincerity of his homosexuality?

    Some research found that “straight” acting gays tend to have better outcomes in life than the most flaming ones. It could be that “straight” gays are better at “passing”, and are treated with more respect, which gives them confidence and they are better able to avoid the nihilist zombie mentality that some gays have.

    • Replies: @Sid
    Buttigieg probably could have passed as straight if he had remained in the closet. Agreed that these types of gays evoke more respect, less disgust from just about everyone.

    Upper middle class bobo SWPLs supported gay marriage in large part to try to not just accept homosexuality, but also to "encourage" gays to act more like straight couples with each other.
    , @Audacious Epigone
    Alternatively, could it simply be that the ones who aren't narcisstically flamboyant also have better mental health in general?
  148. @MikeatMikedotMike
    "White nationalism is a symptom of our nation’s current malaise, it is neither the cause nor a solution."

    So called white nationalism is a symptom of an ever increasing non white population infesting the United States, making demands for access to whites' wealth and or power and or communities.

    If the non white population of the US were under 10%, there would be no white nationalism, because it wouldn't be necessary.


    But no - you think what America needs is a few million more east Asians to build "high trust", Tahla thinks the US needs a few million more muslim Pakistanis, and Thomm thinks the US needs a few million more of his closest H1V Hindu 1st cousins, and Truth want a few trillion more dollars to facilitate all the kids he fathered that he doesn't know about, while cucks like iffen and Feryl look forward to handing their daughters over to any of them.

    And then you want to slander whites as "white nationalists" (read: racist) for daring to notice the walls closing in on the people who built the country to begin with.

    I’m not going to be marching with Dickie Spencer any time soon. The Nazi LARPing*, and the wannabe tough guy/warrior stuff is a bit much.

    *The Nazis representing a declining empire run by people suffering from various degrees of foolishness. They had vast delusions of grandeur, believed in pseudo-science and pseudo-history (saying that all good, or at least strong, people had been “Aryans”), and wanted to liquidate those seen to be historical enemies of Germany (primarily Slavs, of course). The primarily Gen Z idiots who thought it would be, in any way, funny or “effective” to co-opt Nazi stuff for memes or actual ideology are total bufoons who don’t deserve “their” own country. Go out and actually get to know people, hang out with them. They don’t want to hear crank bull-shit about any one being “entitled” to that which is supposedly “theirs”. People get the sort of society they deserve and ask for, and the good guys usually win in the end (hint: in the early-mid 20th century, no German regime could be characterized as “the good guys”; that’s why they lost, they were decadent and foolish, and deserved to be humiliated, unlike the Brits, the French, The Russians, and the Americans who had better leadership).

    Losing “our country”? Do you think the Indians might beg to differ? How about the traditional inhabitants of SE Asia, or much of modern Russia? Tribes grow, move in, get stronger, etc. That’s how it is. Western Europeans had it too good, for too long; they got complacent. There’s nothing any one person can do to alter the trajectory of history; even Hitler, at the end of the day, was a product of his culture and people, if he hadn’t been crazy enough to lead Germany at the peak of it’s arrogance then someone else would have.

    • Replies: @Feryl
    America is a declining empire, and those countries who went along with the ride are going to pay some price for it. Once we lose, it's rock bottom, but just look at drug addict behavior: you have to hit rock bottom to realize the mistakes you've made, and can understand what you have to do in order to get stronger. Nothing is going to stop the collapse, it's just a matter of time. Then we will have to re-group, and go from there.
  149. @Feryl
    I'm not going to be marching with Dickie Spencer any time soon. The Nazi LARPing*, and the wannabe tough guy/warrior stuff is a bit much.


    *The Nazis representing a declining empire run by people suffering from various degrees of foolishness. They had vast delusions of grandeur, believed in pseudo-science and pseudo-history (saying that all good, or at least strong, people had been "Aryans"), and wanted to liquidate those seen to be historical enemies of Germany (primarily Slavs, of course). The primarily Gen Z idiots who thought it would be, in any way, funny or "effective" to co-opt Nazi stuff for memes or actual ideology are total bufoons who don't deserve "their" own country. Go out and actually get to know people, hang out with them. They don't want to hear crank bull-shit about any one being "entitled" to that which is supposedly "theirs". People get the sort of society they deserve and ask for, and the good guys usually win in the end (hint: in the early-mid 20th century, no German regime could be characterized as "the good guys"; that's why they lost, they were decadent and foolish, and deserved to be humiliated, unlike the Brits, the French, The Russians, and the Americans who had better leadership).

    Losing "our country"? Do you think the Indians might beg to differ? How about the traditional inhabitants of SE Asia, or much of modern Russia? Tribes grow, move in, get stronger, etc. That's how it is. Western Europeans had it too good, for too long; they got complacent. There's nothing any one person can do to alter the trajectory of history; even Hitler, at the end of the day, was a product of his culture and people, if he hadn't been crazy enough to lead Germany at the peak of it's arrogance then someone else would have.

    America is a declining empire, and those countries who went along with the ride are going to pay some price for it. Once we lose, it’s rock bottom, but just look at drug addict behavior: you have to hit rock bottom to realize the mistakes you’ve made, and can understand what you have to do in order to get stronger. Nothing is going to stop the collapse, it’s just a matter of time. Then we will have to re-group, and go from there.

    • Replies: @Truth
    ...I hear Stryker has an extra room.
  150. @MikeatMikedotMike
    "White nationalism is a symptom of our nation’s current malaise, it is neither the cause nor a solution."

    So called white nationalism is a symptom of an ever increasing non white population infesting the United States, making demands for access to whites' wealth and or power and or communities.

    If the non white population of the US were under 10%, there would be no white nationalism, because it wouldn't be necessary.


    But no - you think what America needs is a few million more east Asians to build "high trust", Tahla thinks the US needs a few million more muslim Pakistanis, and Thomm thinks the US needs a few million more of his closest H1V Hindu 1st cousins, and Truth want a few trillion more dollars to facilitate all the kids he fathered that he doesn't know about, while cucks like iffen and Feryl look forward to handing their daughters over to any of them.

    And then you want to slander whites as "white nationalists" (read: racist) for daring to notice the walls closing in on the people who built the country to begin with.

    Mike, most American whites don’t even like other white people right now. This isn’t the New Deal era, when most Americans were robustly confident and happy. At any rate, go tell Appalachian whites that they are in dire need of aligning with Yankees from New York and the Pac. NW. They’ll laugh in your face. America has been culturally and regionally fractured, not just ethnically fractured both within and between different groups.

    It’s never a good idea to be a globalist empire. End of story. These things don’t end well. It began to go sour w/Vietnam, and it’s been declining ever since. Sorry. Our elites have a lot humbling events in their future.

  151. What the hell is this crap?!

    Peace.

    • LOL: Truth
    • Replies: @Audacious Epigone
    No, no, of course not.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/dataisbeautiful/comments/4vcxd0/almost_all_men_are_stronger_than_almost_all_women/
  152. @UrbaneFrancoOntarian
    Yup.

    Especially agree with the shout out to Twinkie and Talha. They are good people, sure. But they have to go back since they're racial aliens.

    Furthermore, watch how defensive Twinkie gets when it comes to anything Asian vs. Whites. He's no different from any other Asian, ultra thin skinned and sensitive when it comes to his own race.

    "White nationalism" is literally just a white person with common sense around race. White advocate, white supremacist, doesnt matter. It is simply a white person who is aware of the impending consequences of being a minority (hint: it gets ugly for us).

    But they have to go back since they’re racial aliens.

    You can’t even get white people to vote for limiting immigration levels and you’re fantasising about sending them all back?

    This is the big problem with the alt-right/white nationalists – a reliance on massive amounts of wishful thinking. The big white majority in favour of keeping white countries white just doesn’t exist any longer. No amount of wishful thinking will change that.

    Saying “they all have to go back” just makes you look like (to the normies) like both a Nazi and a nutter.

    • Agree: 216, Audacious Epigone
    • Replies: @notanon

    The big white majority in favour of keeping white countries white just doesn’t exist any longer.
     
    but it did and within living memory.

    television is immensely powerful but it can't hide reality forever if that reality keeps getting worse.
    , @Mr. Rational

    You can’t even get white people to vote for limiting immigration levels
     
    Hogwash.  White people have never been ALLOWED a direct vote on it, and we're at least 70% in favor of slashing or eliminating immigration.  Where we HAVE had votes, like Prop. 187 in California or the Arizona enforcement bill which simply made Federal law into state law as well, the vote was overridden by black-robed tyrants.

    The problem is that we do not have anything resembling a democracy, or even a republic; we are under occupation just as much as the Reconstruction-era South.
  153. @Audacious Epigone
    Surveys consistently show the greatest expressed amount of interracial trust and understanding between whites and Asians than between any other major racial pairings. There are resentments, and I have no idea what a so-called Arctic Alliance would mean or look like, exactly, but the idea that Asian men are at white men's throats is sensationalist, I think.

    the idea that Asian men are at white men’s throats is sensationalist, I think.

    It comes from thinking that the worlds of college and the media are the whole world. If most Asian college students are SJWs then most Asians must be SJWs. If most Asians in the media are SJWs then most Asians must be SJWs.

    I have no idea what a so-called Arctic Alliance would mean or look like, exactly

    The problem with the Arctic Alliance is not that it would be difficult to persuade East Asians to join. The problem is that it would be difficult to persuade white people to join, given that white people don’t see themselves as white people. The assumption behind it is that white people are going to adopt racial identity politics. There is no sign whatsoever that that is likely to happen.

    • Replies: @Audacious Epigone
    South Africa is the blackest pill here. Overt, explicit anti-white hostility directed against the white minority by the ruling party and... and most whites still don't think of themselves politically as whites.
  154. @dfordoom

    But they have to go back since they’re racial aliens.
     
    You can't even get white people to vote for limiting immigration levels and you're fantasising about sending them all back?

    This is the big problem with the alt-right/white nationalists - a reliance on massive amounts of wishful thinking. The big white majority in favour of keeping white countries white just doesn't exist any longer. No amount of wishful thinking will change that.

    Saying "they all have to go back" just makes you look like (to the normies) like both a Nazi and a nutter.

    The big white majority in favour of keeping white countries white just doesn’t exist any longer.

    but it did and within living memory.

    television is immensely powerful but it can’t hide reality forever if that reality keeps getting worse.

    • Replies: @dfordoom

    television is immensely powerful but it can’t hide reality forever if that reality keeps getting worse.
     
    That's just the problem. If you control the media, especially if you control both the traditional media and social media (and Woke Capital does control both), then you can hide reality almost indefinitely.

    But the much bigger problem is that there's a very big chunk of white people who are absolutely delighted with the way things are going. Rich whites are delighted. They're getting richer. Upper middle-class whites are delighted with the situation. They have enough money to live in nice comfortable safe whitopias, and they're making lots of money. White Christians are overjoyed by the current situation - so many opportunities for virtue-signalling! Whites who run small businesses are very pleased - they're getting cheap labour. White male homosexuals are delighted - lots of immigrants to exploit sexually. White college students think everything is great because being an SJW is so much fun - much more fun than actually doing your coursework. White bureaucrats are happy - never have so many bureaucrats been needed!

    None of these white people could care less if in the long term society goes down the toilet. So you don't even need to hide reality from these people. As far as these white people are concerned, as long as only poorer whites are paying the price for gradual social disintegration they just don't care. In fact they're quite pleased to see poor white people suffering.
  155. @William Badwhite

    They want a form of intra-white socialism that requires successful whites (like me) to subsidize them.

     

    Thumm, we've been over this. Road-pooping sub-continentals are not white. Its commendable that you don't want to join the "flight from white", the problem is you couldn't even if you did - you have to be white first.

    created by nature for efficient removal of waste matter

     

    Ah, this gets to why you people can't deal with the sewage in your filthy country. You think nature will just take care of it. No, once you poop in the road, its going to sit there for awhile.

    You should spend less time yapping here on your bizarre obsession with "WN wiggers" and more time in your filthy homeland figuring out how to deal with your sewage.

    er…. no one with an IQ above 70 thinks that I am an ‘Indian’. In displaying your stupidity, you are revealing both your low IQ (70) and extreme homosexuality.

    If you took off your gimp suit and went outside once in a while, you might not have so much trouble evaluating the normal world, nor would you be so out of your depth when interacting with heterosexuals.

    Now, get off my lawn, faggot!

    • Replies: @notanon

    no one with an IQ above 70 thinks that I am an ‘Indian’
     
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDxEvdICKnw
    , @neutral
    No one with any IQ believes you, you are an Indian, you got caught. Now go back to India you coolie.
  156. @Audacious Epigone
    Where are you sourcing this putative 80/20 split from?

    Where are you sourcing this putative 80/20 split from?

    It is an estimation from what little official data there is, combined with anecdotal observation.

    Heartiste has estimated that it is really just 10-12%.

  157. although the arctic alliance thing makes sense at a meta level it doesn’t make sense currently for any group to ally with people who are allowing themselves to be erased.

    on the other hand there is a chance white people will wake up and start reacting.

    so imo what makes most sense for east asians at the moment is to be part of the anti-white pack but hang near the back in case things change – which on average seems to be the position they’ve chosen.

    • Agree: Audacious Epigone
  158. @Jay Fink
    @Thomm

    That 40% figure is surprising to me. My guess is some answer this way to prove a point...to show what loyal WNs they are. It's so hypothetical they can safely answer that way. Yet if they somehow got put in that situation they would choose the black girl over the white dude.

    My guess is some answer this way to prove a point…to show what loyal WNs they are. It’s so hypothetical they can safely answer that way. Yet if they somehow got put in that situation they would choose the black girl over the white dude.

    It is apparent that they truly mean it. When they have convinced themselves that black people are subhuman, then they see a black woman as an animal, and sex with her as bestiality.

    Combine that with the fact that almost 100% of their interaction with fellow whites is with males (virtually no WN actually interacts with white females they are not directly related to, as white women are hypergamous and thus are very well attuned to this concept of which individuals are wastematter), and you get this astonishing degree of aberrant proclivities.

    It is an example of what happens when you combine extreme groupthink with Dunning-Kruger, on top of the fact that this subrace is genetically designated by nature itself to act as a carrier for disposal of unwanted genetic detritus. HBD theory explains it well.

  159. @Thomm
    er.... no one with an IQ above 70 thinks that I am an 'Indian'. In displaying your stupidity, you are revealing both your low IQ (70) and extreme homosexuality.

    If you took off your gimp suit and went outside once in a while, you might not have so much trouble evaluating the normal world, nor would you be so out of your depth when interacting with heterosexuals.

    Now, get off my lawn, faggot!

    no one with an IQ above 70 thinks that I am an ‘Indian’

  160. @notanon

    The big white majority in favour of keeping white countries white just doesn’t exist any longer.
     
    but it did and within living memory.

    television is immensely powerful but it can't hide reality forever if that reality keeps getting worse.

    television is immensely powerful but it can’t hide reality forever if that reality keeps getting worse.

    That’s just the problem. If you control the media, especially if you control both the traditional media and social media (and Woke Capital does control both), then you can hide reality almost indefinitely.

    But the much bigger problem is that there’s a very big chunk of white people who are absolutely delighted with the way things are going. Rich whites are delighted. They’re getting richer. Upper middle-class whites are delighted with the situation. They have enough money to live in nice comfortable safe whitopias, and they’re making lots of money. White Christians are overjoyed by the current situation – so many opportunities for virtue-signalling! Whites who run small businesses are very pleased – they’re getting cheap labour. White male homosexuals are delighted – lots of immigrants to exploit sexually. White college students think everything is great because being an SJW is so much fun – much more fun than actually doing your coursework. White bureaucrats are happy – never have so many bureaucrats been needed!

    None of these white people could care less if in the long term society goes down the toilet. So you don’t even need to hide reality from these people. As far as these white people are concerned, as long as only poorer whites are paying the price for gradual social disintegration they just don’t care. In fact they’re quite pleased to see poor white people suffering.

    • Replies: @notanon
    yawn
    , @Feryl

    But the much bigger problem is that there’s a very big chunk of white people who are absolutely delighted with the way things are going. Rich whites are delighted. They’re getting richer. Upper middle-class whites are delighted with the situation. They have enough money to live in nice comfortable safe whitopias, and they’re making lots of money.
     
    '

    I don't think anyone is that happy right now (according to Peter Turchin, Americans felt better as time went on from 1900-1960, and have been feeling more and more discouraged since 1961). Rather, I think that what the upper classes perceive to be both the problem and the solution are vastly different from what lower class native born people think. For example, most "true" elites (as defined by lots of education and paying tons of money to live in a fashionable area) these days aren't embarrassed to blow tons of cash on status items; back in the New Deal era, this sort of consumption was considered very shameful, because it was understood that it could stir discontent among the lower class (who might feel as if the money being squandered ought to go toward more pro-social things like higher wages). Elites for the last 40 years have largely agreed that it's ok to slash taxes on rich people, and plow tons of money into the stock market/real estate* and conspicuous consumption, rather than the Keynesian/New Deal approach of having elites shoulder more of the tax burden, while they devote their earnings toward investment in things like manufacturing capacity, infrastructure, and better treatment of workers.

    *America is more expensive than ever to live in, in large part due to fiscal policies (debt-based economy) that encourage irresponsible (but elite friendly) cost inflation of stuff like rent, property, medical bills, and education costs. No healthy, viable in the long-term economy should be based on elites profiteering from expenses that have been jacked up so high that vast numbers of mid-lower class American must resort to indebting themselves to get by.

    https://pixel.nymag.com/imgs/daily/intelligencer/2017/12/14/14-inequality-1.nocrop.w710.h2147483647.png

    Every econ. "boom" since the mid-80's keeps going to a smaller and smaller share of the population. That's because wages are stagnant, and living expenses keep going up; few people have investments in the real estate market and stock market, but those who do have been flying high since 1984.

    White Christians are overjoyed by the current situation – so many opportunities for virtue-signalling! Whites who run small businesses are very pleased – they’re getting cheap labour. White male homosexuals are delighted – lots of immigrants to exploit sexually. White college students think everything is great because being an SJW is so much fun – much more fun than actually doing your coursework. White bureaucrats are happy – never have so many bureaucrats been needed!
     
    It took a while, but Xtiandom is basically dying off, relative to what it was in the 90's (or prior decades). Europeans lost interest in the mid-20th century, and North Americans have lost interest in the early 21st century.

    Most gays are apathetic toward politics. Today's college students are about the most miserable class of people you could imagine, as stress and anxiety have been recorded at very high levels. Living in a Gilded Age really is just not much fun for anyone; lower class people just scrape by (if they manage to stay off the street or out of prison), while upper class people are constantly arguing, back stabbing, and nervous that they could be knocked off their perch by fellow elites or populist revolutionaries.
    , @Audacious Epigone
    This is a depressingly perspicacious comment, thanks.
  161. @dfordoom

    television is immensely powerful but it can’t hide reality forever if that reality keeps getting worse.
     
    That's just the problem. If you control the media, especially if you control both the traditional media and social media (and Woke Capital does control both), then you can hide reality almost indefinitely.

    But the much bigger problem is that there's a very big chunk of white people who are absolutely delighted with the way things are going. Rich whites are delighted. They're getting richer. Upper middle-class whites are delighted with the situation. They have enough money to live in nice comfortable safe whitopias, and they're making lots of money. White Christians are overjoyed by the current situation - so many opportunities for virtue-signalling! Whites who run small businesses are very pleased - they're getting cheap labour. White male homosexuals are delighted - lots of immigrants to exploit sexually. White college students think everything is great because being an SJW is so much fun - much more fun than actually doing your coursework. White bureaucrats are happy - never have so many bureaucrats been needed!

    None of these white people could care less if in the long term society goes down the toilet. So you don't even need to hide reality from these people. As far as these white people are concerned, as long as only poorer whites are paying the price for gradual social disintegration they just don't care. In fact they're quite pleased to see poor white people suffering.

    yawn

  162. @Truth
    Buttigieg is definitely the SWPL candidate of choice. Well educated, highly literate, and he appears to be a respectable gay man married to a husband, and not a creepy degenerate.

    Wow, I guess I'm really not in 1993 anymore.

    It isn’t. Gay men who at least give off the appearance of monogamous marital commitment are highly appealing to SWPLs.

  163. Sid says:
    @Feryl
    Some research found that "straight" acting gays tend to have better outcomes in life than the most flaming ones. It could be that "straight" gays are better at "passing", and are treated with more respect, which gives them confidence and they are better able to avoid the nihilist zombie mentality that some gays have.

    Buttigieg probably could have passed as straight if he had remained in the closet. Agreed that these types of gays evoke more respect, less disgust from just about everyone.

    Upper middle class bobo SWPLs supported gay marriage in large part to try to not just accept homosexuality, but also to “encourage” gays to act more like straight couples with each other.

    • Replies: @dfordoom

    Upper middle class bobo SWPLs supported gay marriage in large part to try to not just accept homosexuality, but also to “encourage” gays to act more like straight couples with each other.
     
    Homosexual marriage is a way of making homosexuality sound nice. It's a way of mentally blocking out the reality.
  164. Sid says:
    @UrbaneFrancoOntarian
    Cringe.

    The artic alliance is pure cringe.

    Coping for whites who want an ally.

    Hey whitey: Asian males hate you. They hate you because you're better looking than them, you're taller than them, their women thirst after you, because you 'sold them opium', you are just better, you have lighter skin, etc. etc. etc.

    Non-whites do not like white men nor will they look after them at all. Grow up.

    Arctic Alliance is probably a stretch.

    That said, East Asian men are almost surely the least woke among non-whites. They’re usually less interested in politics, disinclined to openly whine, and are big winners in a principled stance against miscegenation.

    Internationally, East Asian countries consider Campaign Trump’s talk about a border wall, halting illegal immigration, and putting your own country’s interests first to be anodyne common sense.

    Will white and yellow men march alongside each other? For the most part, no. They’re not us. But there’s common ground in our interests, and we’re leaving money on the ground if we don’t try to utilize that.

  165. @Truth
    "Reparations" is just my umbrella term for all of the Al(abaster) Sharpton stuff you guys do about Duh man holdin' you down. As for race-baiting, let's again, examine a part of your post:


    I suspect the former president will not. That’s what eight years of loyal service gets Biden–a snub!
     
    Now ask yourself; "What exactly, does Barry owe Uncle Gropy?" I mean, first of all, it hasn't happened yet, secondly, who gave whom a F- Job.?"

    Unless you were referring to some other reason that Barry would decline to make an endorsement, rather then the one I conjured up out of nowhere in my pea brain, wardrobe, unpaid debts in a card game, whatever, then yes, I would consider this "race baiting."

    I would consider this “race baiting.”

    AE appears to expect loyalty from opportunistic politicians. I am certain that neither Obama or Biden make that mistake.

    Along the same lines, now that blacks are abandoning Biden, all those pundits that wrote all those paragraphs praising blacks for showing loyalty and gratitude are going to have do a lot of memory holing.

    • Replies: @Truth
    They do show extreme loyalty; to whoever is wearing the donkey badge in August, 2020.
  166. @MikeatMikedotMike
    "WN consider it of low importance that whites are routinely outperformed by Asians on many social indicators."

    And if you were half a honest as you think you are you'd concede that your point, however true or not, is irrelevant to the fact that whites have as much right as any other ethnic or racial group to their own nation, separate from all these "better people" who can't seem to help their need to be as close to whites as possible.

    whites have as much right as any other ethnic or racial group to their own nation

    I’ve never said that you WNs don’t have that right. I just say that you can’t have mine.

  167. @MikeatMikedotMike
    LOL - you're the biggest cuck on Ae's comment section. Go cry to your negro co-workers about it.

    LOL – you’re the biggest cuck on Ae’s comment section.

    And you are the biggest dimwit. I am decidedly not a conservative. I would tell you to find a comment where I claim to be a conservative, but you couldn’t find it even if it was there. You are one of these idiots that think you can change the definition of a word all by yourself.

  168. @216

    And if you were half a honest as you think you are you’d concede that your point, however true or not, is irrelevant to the fact that whites have as much right as any other ethnic or racial group to their own nation, separate from all these “better people” who can’t seem to help their need to be as close to whites as possible.
     
    The enemy does not concede the point that we are entitled to self-determination. Rather, they agitate for increasing dilution of national sovereignty through multi-lateral, supra-national and non-governmental organizations.

    At best, the enemy concedes a marginal right to privacy in your own thoughts, free of the torment of others. There is a distinction between the contempt of the elite, versus the envy of the masses. The elite oppose us with a religious ferocity.

    As a moral point, we should encourage excellence. If Asians are beating Whites, then whites need to find ways of meeting and beating the Asian standard. There is no excuse for whites abusing drugs and committing crime at higher rates than Asians. Nor is there an excuse for the higher obesity of whites.

    ” If Asians are beating Whites, then whites need to find ways of meeting and beating the Asian standard. ”

    Not necessary with separate nations. When the US was 85% white, it was dong fine in comparison to China.

    “There is no excuse for whites abusing drugs and committing crime at higher rates than Asians. Nor is there an excuse for the higher obesity of whites.”

    LOL – yeah let’s just throw causality out the window! Let’s just look at the result without examining the process! White criminality, obesity and drug abuse were fractions of what they are now before the 1960’s. Gee, I wonder what changed??? I mean besides just about everything?

    Similarly, by your logic there is no excuse for North Koreans to not be thriving equally to their South Koreans relatives.

    • Replies: @216

    Not necessary with separate nations. When the US was 85% white, it was dong fine in comparison to China.
     
    Wish fulfillment

    LOL – yeah let’s just throw causality out the window! Let’s just look at the result without examining the process! White criminality, obesity and drug abuse were fractions of what they are now before the 1960’s. Gee, I wonder what changed??? I mean besides just about everything?
     
    Crime, obesity and drugs are personal failures, not systemic failures. We should not copy the worst feaure of black politics: that of claiming helplessness.

    Similarly, by your logic there is no excuse for North Koreans to not be thriving equally to their South Koreans relatives.
     
    There is no excuse for Kim Jong Un to be obese. That more than anything is undermining his negotiating position.
  169. @Twinkie

    you think what America needs is a few million more east Asians to build “high trust”
     
    I’m an immigration restrictionist, including that from Asia.

    “I’m an immigration restrictionist, including that from Asia.”

    “Restrictionist.” So I guess you don’t think the entire world should come here. Otherwise, that term is useless because it can be applied relatively. 100 million want to come, but I only allowed 10 million to enter. See? I’m a restrictionist!

    I’m an immigration abolishist. The US does not need, nor can it afford, a single additional individual, from anywhere.

    • Replies: @Truth
    Not even Israel? You know your nephew Noam has had his hear set on living in New York for years.
    , @Twinkie

    “Restrictionist.” So I guess you don’t think the entire world should come here. Otherwise, that term is useless because it can be applied relatively. 100 million want to come, but I only allowed 10 million to enter. See? I’m a restrictionist!
     
    Don’t be a moron. It’s easy to be an absolutist on the Internet.* The more useful question is determining which side of the fence you want people to be. Broadly, there are three groups of voters and interests: 1) people who like the status quo, 2) people who want to increase immigration, and 3) people who want to reduce immigration.

    Do you want to win or do you want to alienate the bulk of no. 3 with your stupid “they have to all go back” fantasy? You have to first get most voters on the restriction side (and make that a political priority). Once that is achieved, the rest is just negotiating. My personal view is that we should dramatically reduce illegal immigration with very tough enforcement AND also significantly curtail legal immigration. Currently we have had roughly 1 million per year for the past decade. I’d like to see that number drop to at least 100,000 - 200,000 per annum. And I also would like to abolish the H1B visas.

    Would further reductions be desirable? I think they would be, but, frankly, even getting to the above scenario would be a near miracle, so debating about how much more at that point is a waste of time and perhaps even counterproductive.

    *I am a 2nd Amendment absolutist. I want suppressed select-fire weapons for everyone. But I’m not going to waste my breath or keystrokes on that fantasy when there are more dire threats and issues at hand. The left beats us by incrementalism, and we would be wise to learn their methodology.

  170. 216 says:
    @MikeatMikedotMike
    " If Asians are beating Whites, then whites need to find ways of meeting and beating the Asian standard. "

    Not necessary with separate nations. When the US was 85% white, it was dong fine in comparison to China.

    "There is no excuse for whites abusing drugs and committing crime at higher rates than Asians. Nor is there an excuse for the higher obesity of whites."

    LOL - yeah let's just throw causality out the window! Let's just look at the result without examining the process! White criminality, obesity and drug abuse were fractions of what they are now before the 1960's. Gee, I wonder what changed??? I mean besides just about everything?

    Similarly, by your logic there is no excuse for North Koreans to not be thriving equally to their South Koreans relatives.

    Not necessary with separate nations. When the US was 85% white, it was dong fine in comparison to China.

    Wish fulfillment

    LOL – yeah let’s just throw causality out the window! Let’s just look at the result without examining the process! White criminality, obesity and drug abuse were fractions of what they are now before the 1960’s. Gee, I wonder what changed??? I mean besides just about everything?

    Crime, obesity and drugs are personal failures, not systemic failures. We should not copy the worst feaure of black politics: that of claiming helplessness.

    Similarly, by your logic there is no excuse for North Koreans to not be thriving equally to their South Koreans relatives.

    There is no excuse for Kim Jong Un to be obese. That more than anything is undermining his negotiating position.

    • Replies: @MikeatMikedotMike
    "Wish fulfillment"

    Nope. Plain fact.

    "Crime, obesity and drugs are personal failures, not systemic failures. "

    You're absolutely wrong. It's a combination of both. The system has been teaching white American children to hate themselves for at least 3 generations, as well as taking away their jobs and shoveling Oxycontin and starch in their faces. You and your 150 IQ apparently don't understand the near insurmountable effort it requires just for one average IQ individual to unlearn a lifetime of disinformation. Have you really not been paying attention what's happening in this country the last 100 years?

    "We should not copy the worst feaure of black politics: that of claiming helplessness."

    Straw man. Blacks were better off regarding those three issues before the 60's as well.

    "There is no excuse for Kim Jong Un to be obese. That more than anything is undermining his negotiating position."

    Translation: You're right , and I have no answer to this clear and valid example of your point so I'll just deflect with snark.

    , @SFG
    There is no excuse for Kim Jong Un to be obese. That more than anything is undermining his negotiating position.

    Given he can shoot anyone who looks at him side-eyed, he has little motivation to stay thin...
  171. @Twinkie

    I feel that there are other groups who fit this description, although I can’t think of whom they are right now…
     
    Go bark up another tree. I’ve written time and again that I want fulfillment and dignity for all my fellow Americans, including, yes, blacks - at minimum, because our fates are tied. Black problems eventually become those for other Americans sooner or later.

    I want blacks to do better than they have in the past, but that doesn’t mean I think they are capable of achieving the same level of prosperity as other groups. I don’t believe in “closing the gap” - I believe in people doing as best as they can, realistically. Not everyone is born with the same abilities, whether as individuals or as groups.

    That’s a good, measured, and logical response Big Twinx.

    …I was referring to Menonites, but it’s nice knowing how you feel about those black people.

  172. 3309527

    Fully agree. But note that the WN wiggers (the bottom 20% of white men) have zero interest in excellence or even basic competence, so they drag down our averages. White would outperform Asians if the wastematter subrace were excised.

    This rhetoric isn’t helpful.

    • Replies: @MikeatMikedotMike
    It's extremely helpful. He is merely documenting for the record what most of the alien residents in the US are thinking.

    I appreciate his candor in helping whites wake up to what they are facing.
    , @Thomm

    This rhetoric isn’t helpful.
     
    I would argue that it is, since it is necessary to flag exactly which individuals account for all of the total underperformance.
  173. @Feryl
    As America becomes Brazil El Norte, blacks will become an embarrassing headache that most people consign to the bottom of the heap without much thought. No longer will they be the default "victim" of a dreadful past from which they can't escape. Old-school racial narratives just don't apply to America anymore. As of right now, Hispanics now outnumber blacks in this country.

    Whether people publicly admit it or not, they are tired of blacks bitching about everything, and preying on people, and would much rather deal with bookish Asians and taciturn Mexicans. I know that some Boomers make the (goofy and overly sentimental) case that various ethnic groups are supposed to be so disagreeable that they want everything about the demographics of 1970 to come back*, even if it evidently means tolerating vast sections of NYC and Los Angeles being no-go wastelands due to the menacing and surly blacks.

    *Various white generations are to some degree flawed in their outlook and even behavior, but that being said, they still don't cause as much trouble as blacks; whites look back at decades like the 1920's and 1970's with shame and embarrassment, and consider them well out-side the norm of white values and mainly caused by particularly reckless generations (the Lost Generation, and the Boomer Generation).

    I guess the operative question a man a man in your position must ask, Feral, is “will it happen while I am alive?”

  174. @Feryl
    America is a declining empire, and those countries who went along with the ride are going to pay some price for it. Once we lose, it's rock bottom, but just look at drug addict behavior: you have to hit rock bottom to realize the mistakes you've made, and can understand what you have to do in order to get stronger. Nothing is going to stop the collapse, it's just a matter of time. Then we will have to re-group, and go from there.

    …I hear Stryker has an extra room.

  175. @iffen
    I would consider this “race baiting.”

    AE appears to expect loyalty from opportunistic politicians. I am certain that neither Obama or Biden make that mistake.

    Along the same lines, now that blacks are abandoning Biden, all those pundits that wrote all those paragraphs praising blacks for showing loyalty and gratitude are going to have do a lot of memory holing.

    They do show extreme loyalty; to whoever is wearing the donkey badge in August, 2020.

  176. @MikeatMikedotMike
    "I’m an immigration restrictionist, including that from Asia."

    "Restrictionist." So I guess you don't think the entire world should come here. Otherwise, that term is useless because it can be applied relatively. 100 million want to come, but I only allowed 10 million to enter. See? I'm a restrictionist!

    I'm an immigration abolishist. The US does not need, nor can it afford, a single additional individual, from anywhere.

    Not even Israel? You know your nephew Noam has had his hear set on living in New York for years.

  177. @216
    Is it Envy on my part?

    I don't think so.

    Envy is their path, I am encouraging us to act with Charity. People will not stop coming to the First World unless they are given a carrot to accompany the stick. Our people forget that.

    People will not stop coming to the First World unless they are given a carrot to accompany the stick.

    They’ll stop coming when we stop letting them in, and punish them for coming here illegally.  People can and will be charitable, but we don’t owe them anything.

    If they’re our equals or even superiors, let them build nice countries like the one we made and they want to come to instead of doing the hard work themselves.  If they’re our inferiors, they have no business being here period.

    • Agree: Sick of Orcs
    • Replies: @216

    They’ll stop coming when we stop letting them in, and punish them for coming here illegally. People can and will be charitable, but we don’t owe them anything.
     
    We don't govern our own culture, white liberals own it. No immigration control is getting passed without a portion of white liberals and/or non-whites giving assent to it.

    It's a widespread belief that Third World despoliation is the result of white greed. That can't be handwaved away. Military expenditure must be slashed, and a portion diverted as bribes masked as "development funding".
  178. @216

    Not necessary with separate nations. When the US was 85% white, it was dong fine in comparison to China.
     
    Wish fulfillment

    LOL – yeah let’s just throw causality out the window! Let’s just look at the result without examining the process! White criminality, obesity and drug abuse were fractions of what they are now before the 1960’s. Gee, I wonder what changed??? I mean besides just about everything?
     
    Crime, obesity and drugs are personal failures, not systemic failures. We should not copy the worst feaure of black politics: that of claiming helplessness.

    Similarly, by your logic there is no excuse for North Koreans to not be thriving equally to their South Koreans relatives.
     
    There is no excuse for Kim Jong Un to be obese. That more than anything is undermining his negotiating position.

    “Wish fulfillment”

    Nope. Plain fact.

    “Crime, obesity and drugs are personal failures, not systemic failures. ”

    You’re absolutely wrong. It’s a combination of both. The system has been teaching white American children to hate themselves for at least 3 generations, as well as taking away their jobs and shoveling Oxycontin and starch in their faces. You and your 150 IQ apparently don’t understand the near insurmountable effort it requires just for one average IQ individual to unlearn a lifetime of disinformation. Have you really not been paying attention what’s happening in this country the last 100 years?

    “We should not copy the worst feaure of black politics: that of claiming helplessness.”

    Straw man. Blacks were better off regarding those three issues before the 60’s as well.

    “There is no excuse for Kim Jong Un to be obese. That more than anything is undermining his negotiating position.”

    Translation: You’re right , and I have no answer to this clear and valid example of your point so I’ll just deflect with snark.

    • Agree: Mr. Rational
    • Replies: @216

    You’re absolutely wrong. It’s a combination of both. The system has been teaching white American children to hate themselves for at least 3 generations, as well as taking away their jobs and shoveling Oxycontin and starch in their faces.
     
    This is just not true. White Americans continually display higher levels of patriotism than white Europeans, and the guilt tripping is far more intense in Germany, but levels of obesity and drug use are lower.

    Straw man. Blacks were better off regarding those three issues before the 60’s as well.
     
    I wasn't discussing black dysfunction in lifestyle, I was criticizing a trend of black politics that our people are copying.
  179. @Thomm
    er.... no one with an IQ above 70 thinks that I am an 'Indian'. In displaying your stupidity, you are revealing both your low IQ (70) and extreme homosexuality.

    If you took off your gimp suit and went outside once in a while, you might not have so much trouble evaluating the normal world, nor would you be so out of your depth when interacting with heterosexuals.

    Now, get off my lawn, faggot!

    No one with any IQ believes you, you are an Indian, you got caught. Now go back to India you coolie.

  180. @216

    Fully agree. But note that the WN wiggers (the bottom 20% of white men) have zero interest in excellence or even basic competence, so they drag down our averages. White would outperform Asians if the wastematter subrace were excised.
     
    This rhetoric isn't helpful.

    It’s extremely helpful. He is merely documenting for the record what most of the alien residents in the US are thinking.

    I appreciate his candor in helping whites wake up to what they are facing.

    • Agree: neutral
  181. @dfordoom

    But they have to go back since they’re racial aliens.
     
    You can't even get white people to vote for limiting immigration levels and you're fantasising about sending them all back?

    This is the big problem with the alt-right/white nationalists - a reliance on massive amounts of wishful thinking. The big white majority in favour of keeping white countries white just doesn't exist any longer. No amount of wishful thinking will change that.

    Saying "they all have to go back" just makes you look like (to the normies) like both a Nazi and a nutter.

    You can’t even get white people to vote for limiting immigration levels

    Hogwash.  White people have never been ALLOWED a direct vote on it, and we’re at least 70% in favor of slashing or eliminating immigration.  Where we HAVE had votes, like Prop. 187 in California or the Arizona enforcement bill which simply made Federal law into state law as well, the vote was overridden by black-robed tyrants.

    The problem is that we do not have anything resembling a democracy, or even a republic; we are under occupation just as much as the Reconstruction-era South.

    • Replies: @216
    Oregon voted last year to preserve sanctuary cities.

    Sherrod Brown was re-elected in Ohio last year.
    , @dfordoom

    Hogwash. White people have never been ALLOWED a direct vote on it, and we’re at least 70% in favor of slashing or eliminating immigration.
     
    When people in white countries have been given the opportunity to vote for anti-immigration parties they have consistently failed to do so. There have been such opportunities - the BNP in Britain, One Nation in Australia, AfD in Germany.

    It seems likely that the explanation is that white people don't like immigration but they don't consider it to be a vital issue. It seems likely that they prefer to put short-term greed ahead of the long-term future of their nations.

    One has to wonder whether democracy was a good idea.
  182. 216 says:
    @MikeatMikedotMike
    "Wish fulfillment"

    Nope. Plain fact.

    "Crime, obesity and drugs are personal failures, not systemic failures. "

    You're absolutely wrong. It's a combination of both. The system has been teaching white American children to hate themselves for at least 3 generations, as well as taking away their jobs and shoveling Oxycontin and starch in their faces. You and your 150 IQ apparently don't understand the near insurmountable effort it requires just for one average IQ individual to unlearn a lifetime of disinformation. Have you really not been paying attention what's happening in this country the last 100 years?

    "We should not copy the worst feaure of black politics: that of claiming helplessness."

    Straw man. Blacks were better off regarding those three issues before the 60's as well.

    "There is no excuse for Kim Jong Un to be obese. That more than anything is undermining his negotiating position."

    Translation: You're right , and I have no answer to this clear and valid example of your point so I'll just deflect with snark.

    You’re absolutely wrong. It’s a combination of both. The system has been teaching white American children to hate themselves for at least 3 generations, as well as taking away their jobs and shoveling Oxycontin and starch in their faces.

    This is just not true. White Americans continually display higher levels of patriotism than white Europeans, and the guilt tripping is far more intense in Germany, but levels of obesity and drug use are lower.

    Straw man. Blacks were better off regarding those three issues before the 60’s as well.

    I wasn’t discussing black dysfunction in lifestyle, I was criticizing a trend of black politics that our people are copying.

    • Replies: @MikeatMikedotMike
    "White Americans continually display higher levels of patriotism than white Europeans, and the guilt tripping is far more intense in Germany, but levels of obesity and drug use are lower."

    I am not an expert on German economics, but are they conducting a job outsourcing campaign similar to what the US has perpetrated upon its working class the last 40 years? Does Germany have 100's of defacto ghost towns littering its equivalent of the Rust Belt and midwest, where manufacturing and industry once thrived? No? What is the size and scope and influence of Germany's pharmaceutical leviathan in comparison to the US's? Does Germany have the world's biggest 3rd world narco state occupying over a 1000 miles of its porous southern boarder? Does Germany have separate graduations for its high school kids in Russian? What does Germany's sugar and farming lobby look like in comparison to the US? Have they had the disastrous "Food Pyramid" seared into their brains the last 60 years? Does Germany have 10's of 1000's of white ME war veterans consuming SSRI's in "treatment" of PSTD? Does Germany have an entire sub-culture of feral negros promoting a glamorous version of ghetto life, marketed directly at a susceptible white youth?

    And finally, probably most importantly, even as of 2017 Germany was still 89% European and 75% ethnic German. No doubt that will change within a couple generations. When the European percentage of the total population of Germany drops to 65%, then let's revisit their drug addiction, obesity, and criminality rates.

    "I wasn’t discussing black dysfunction in lifestyle, I was criticizing a trend of black politics that our people are copying."

    You'd have a point if the entire system wasn't currently designed to prop up negros (to their and everyone else's detriment) in every possibly way. Whites OTOH, have the entire system working against them. In other words, negros actually have nothing to complain about; they're handed everything. Whites are not.

    You can read that last sentence as complaint, but it is pure observation.

    So instead of you and I continuing to go round and round, let me hear your solutions. Lawfare? The courts are against us and the people who appoint judges are against us. Retweets? Account suspended. Raising awareness? Cville outcome. Blank white piece of paper? Racist!
  183. @Feryl
    Could someone please explain to me what it is about SW Asians that entitles them to inherit the mantle of Progressive thought? The whole thing smacks of opportunism and shamelessness, moreover the globalists who run mainstream Western news certainly like to think of SW Asians as being soldiers of corporate approved wokeness in good standing. Hispanics are too languid, East Asians are too peaceful and timid, and blacks are too unruly (and liable to dis and attack their one time allies).

    Could someone please explain to me what it is about SW Asians that entitles them to inherit the mantle of Progressive thought?

    They’re influenced by the ugliness of ultra conservatism back home? This was a successful 2017 movie, apparently based on what’s really happening there:

    Keshav (Akshay Kumar) has to marry a black buffalo because his father (Panditji) is a very religious and superstitious priest, and he believes that his son’s marriage to a black buffalo will help improve Keshav’s fortune.

    Keshav meets Jaya (Bhumi Pednekar), an educated college going girl, falls in love with her and eventually convinces her to marry him. However, Keshav’s father is of the view that Keshav’s horoscope is such that he can and should only marry a girl who has two thumbs on her left hand. Since Jaya does not fulfill this requirement, Keshav has an artificial thumb made and gives it to Jaya who wears it as a ring on her thumb. Keshav’s unsuspecting father agrees to their marriage.
    (…)
    After a futile attempt to convince his sarpanch and villagers to build toilets in the village, Keshav, with the help of Jaya, contacts the concerned regulatory authority and starts the construction of a toilet in his front yard. When the construction is finished, Keshav’s father and the sarpanch arrange to demolish the toilet while Keshav is still asleep. But Keshav wakes up before the toilet is completely destroyed and protects it from complete demolition.

    Jaya now files for a divorce in the local court citing the unavailability of a toilet in her husband’s house as the primary reason for seeking a divorce. Due to its unique nature, the case gets a lot of media attention. Politicians and the concerned government departments spring into action to hasten the process of constructing toilets in Keshav’s village. But Keshav’s father remains steadfast on his decision to not have a toilet in his house, until one day, his mother, while going out to defecate, falls on the doorstep, injures her hip and cries vehemently that she can’t possibly walk to the fields to defecate, and that she must use the toilet that Keshav constructed in the front yard. After much reluctance, Keshav’s father gives in and helps his mother to the toilet. He then realises that a toilet is indeed a critical requirement within a household.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toilet:_Ek_Prem_Katha

    • Replies: @Audacious Epigone
    This was a movie plot?

    I'll never be a good cosmopolitan, ever. I just don't have it in me.
  184. 216 says:
    @Mr. Rational

    People will not stop coming to the First World unless they are given a carrot to accompany the stick.
     
    They'll stop coming when we stop letting them in, and punish them for coming here illegally.  People can and will be charitable, but we don't owe them anything.

    If they're our equals or even superiors, let them build nice countries like the one we made and they want to come to instead of doing the hard work themselves.  If they're our inferiors, they have no business being here period.

    They’ll stop coming when we stop letting them in, and punish them for coming here illegally. People can and will be charitable, but we don’t owe them anything.

    We don’t govern our own culture, white liberals own it. No immigration control is getting passed without a portion of white liberals and/or non-whites giving assent to it.

    It’s a widespread belief that Third World despoliation is the result of white greed. That can’t be handwaved away. Military expenditure must be slashed, and a portion diverted as bribes masked as “development funding”.

    • Replies: @Talha
    Empire must end so people can’t use it for guilt tripping purposes. Unfortunately, many of the same people (not necessarily here in UNZ) who support closing borders, love them some new aircraft careers to kill Persians.

    Peace.
  185. @Mr. Rational

    You can’t even get white people to vote for limiting immigration levels
     
    Hogwash.  White people have never been ALLOWED a direct vote on it, and we're at least 70% in favor of slashing or eliminating immigration.  Where we HAVE had votes, like Prop. 187 in California or the Arizona enforcement bill which simply made Federal law into state law as well, the vote was overridden by black-robed tyrants.

    The problem is that we do not have anything resembling a democracy, or even a republic; we are under occupation just as much as the Reconstruction-era South.

    Oregon voted last year to preserve sanctuary cities.

    Sherrod Brown was re-elected in Ohio last year.

  186. @216

    They’ll stop coming when we stop letting them in, and punish them for coming here illegally. People can and will be charitable, but we don’t owe them anything.
     
    We don't govern our own culture, white liberals own it. No immigration control is getting passed without a portion of white liberals and/or non-whites giving assent to it.

    It's a widespread belief that Third World despoliation is the result of white greed. That can't be handwaved away. Military expenditure must be slashed, and a portion diverted as bribes masked as "development funding".

    Empire must end so people can’t use it for guilt tripping purposes. Unfortunately, many of the same people (not necessarily here in UNZ) who support closing borders, love them some new aircraft careers to kill Persians.

    Peace.

    • Replies: @dfordoom

    Empire must end so people can’t use it for guilt tripping purposes. Unfortunately, many of the same people (not necessarily here in UNZ) who support closing borders, love them some new aircraft careers to kill Persians.
     
    Agreed. And this doesn't just apply to the U.S. either - the British still haven't accepted that the British Empire is gone which is why they're so anxious to tag along every time the American Empire has a new war to fight. Which makes it easy to argue that if the British end up having their country taken away from them it's just legitimate payback for their imperialism.

    And given just how sleazy and disreputable the history of the British Empire was, anyone making that argument has a point. The British have much to be ashamed of.
  187. @216

    Fully agree. But note that the WN wiggers (the bottom 20% of white men) have zero interest in excellence or even basic competence, so they drag down our averages. White would outperform Asians if the wastematter subrace were excised.
     
    This rhetoric isn't helpful.

    This rhetoric isn’t helpful.

    I would argue that it is, since it is necessary to flag exactly which individuals account for all of the total underperformance.

  188. @216

    You’re absolutely wrong. It’s a combination of both. The system has been teaching white American children to hate themselves for at least 3 generations, as well as taking away their jobs and shoveling Oxycontin and starch in their faces.
     
    This is just not true. White Americans continually display higher levels of patriotism than white Europeans, and the guilt tripping is far more intense in Germany, but levels of obesity and drug use are lower.

    Straw man. Blacks were better off regarding those three issues before the 60’s as well.
     
    I wasn't discussing black dysfunction in lifestyle, I was criticizing a trend of black politics that our people are copying.

    “White Americans continually display higher levels of patriotism than white Europeans, and the guilt tripping is far more intense in Germany, but levels of obesity and drug use are lower.”

    I am not an expert on German economics, but are they conducting a job outsourcing campaign similar to what the US has perpetrated upon its working class the last 40 years? Does Germany have 100’s of defacto ghost towns littering its equivalent of the Rust Belt and midwest, where manufacturing and industry once thrived? No? What is the size and scope and influence of Germany’s pharmaceutical leviathan in comparison to the US’s? Does Germany have the world’s biggest 3rd world narco state occupying over a 1000 miles of its porous southern boarder? Does Germany have separate graduations for its high school kids in Russian? What does Germany’s sugar and farming lobby look like in comparison to the US? Have they had the disastrous “Food Pyramid” seared into their brains the last 60 years? Does Germany have 10’s of 1000’s of white ME war veterans consuming SSRI’s in “treatment” of PSTD? Does Germany have an entire sub-culture of feral negros promoting a glamorous version of ghetto life, marketed directly at a susceptible white youth?

    And finally, probably most importantly, even as of 2017 Germany was still 89% European and 75% ethnic German. No doubt that will change within a couple generations. When the European percentage of the total population of Germany drops to 65%, then let’s revisit their drug addiction, obesity, and criminality rates.

    “I wasn’t discussing black dysfunction in lifestyle, I was criticizing a trend of black politics that our people are copying.”

    You’d have a point if the entire system wasn’t currently designed to prop up negros (to their and everyone else’s detriment) in every possibly way. Whites OTOH, have the entire system working against them. In other words, negros actually have nothing to complain about; they’re handed everything. Whites are not.

    You can read that last sentence as complaint, but it is pure observation.

    So instead of you and I continuing to go round and round, let me hear your solutions. Lawfare? The courts are against us and the people who appoint judges are against us. Retweets? Account suspended. Raising awareness? Cville outcome. Blank white piece of paper? Racist!

    • Replies: @216

    So instead of you and I continuing to go round and round, let me hear your solutions. Lawfare? The courts are against us and the people who appoint judges are against us. Retweets? Account suspended. Raising awareness? Cville outcome. Blank white piece of paper? Racist!
     
    Commnity building

    Building an alternative economy
    , @Feryl

    I am not an expert on German economics, but are they conducting a job outsourcing campaign similar to what the US has perpetrated upon its working class the last 40 years? Does Germany have 100’s of defacto ghost towns littering its equivalent of the Rust Belt and midwest, where manufacturing and industry once thrived? No? What is the size and scope and influence of Germany’s pharmaceutical leviathan in comparison to the US’s? Does Germany have the world’s biggest 3rd world narco state occupying over a 1000 miles of its porous southern boarder? Does Germany have separate graduations for its high school kids in Russian? What does Germany’s sugar and farming lobby look like in comparison to the US? Have they had the disastrous “Food Pyramid” seared into their brains the last 60 years? Does Germany have 10’s of 1000’s of white ME war veterans consuming SSRI’s in “treatment” of PSTD? Does Germany have an entire sub-culture of feral negros promoting a glamorous version of ghetto life, marketed directly at a susceptible white youth?
     
    Germany is not currently an empire trying to control and occupy virtually the entire world. It's amazing what a country can accomplish on it's own soil when it isn't trying to "export" it's culture and power across the world.
  189. @UrbaneFrancoOntarian
    Uhh...

    Well I think ZeroHedge has a decent format.

    My favourite comment platform is Disqus though.

    Ok – I’ll suggest these to him.

    Peace.

  190. 216 says:
    @MikeatMikedotMike
    "White Americans continually display higher levels of patriotism than white Europeans, and the guilt tripping is far more intense in Germany, but levels of obesity and drug use are lower."

    I am not an expert on German economics, but are they conducting a job outsourcing campaign similar to what the US has perpetrated upon its working class the last 40 years? Does Germany have 100's of defacto ghost towns littering its equivalent of the Rust Belt and midwest, where manufacturing and industry once thrived? No? What is the size and scope and influence of Germany's pharmaceutical leviathan in comparison to the US's? Does Germany have the world's biggest 3rd world narco state occupying over a 1000 miles of its porous southern boarder? Does Germany have separate graduations for its high school kids in Russian? What does Germany's sugar and farming lobby look like in comparison to the US? Have they had the disastrous "Food Pyramid" seared into their brains the last 60 years? Does Germany have 10's of 1000's of white ME war veterans consuming SSRI's in "treatment" of PSTD? Does Germany have an entire sub-culture of feral negros promoting a glamorous version of ghetto life, marketed directly at a susceptible white youth?

    And finally, probably most importantly, even as of 2017 Germany was still 89% European and 75% ethnic German. No doubt that will change within a couple generations. When the European percentage of the total population of Germany drops to 65%, then let's revisit their drug addiction, obesity, and criminality rates.

    "I wasn’t discussing black dysfunction in lifestyle, I was criticizing a trend of black politics that our people are copying."

    You'd have a point if the entire system wasn't currently designed to prop up negros (to their and everyone else's detriment) in every possibly way. Whites OTOH, have the entire system working against them. In other words, negros actually have nothing to complain about; they're handed everything. Whites are not.

    You can read that last sentence as complaint, but it is pure observation.

    So instead of you and I continuing to go round and round, let me hear your solutions. Lawfare? The courts are against us and the people who appoint judges are against us. Retweets? Account suspended. Raising awareness? Cville outcome. Blank white piece of paper? Racist!

    So instead of you and I continuing to go round and round, let me hear your solutions. Lawfare? The courts are against us and the people who appoint judges are against us. Retweets? Account suspended. Raising awareness? Cville outcome. Blank white piece of paper? Racist!

    Commnity building

    Building an alternative economy

    • Replies: @iffen
    Yes!

    Little platoons.

    Although, no one who advocates for this can explain how the new little platoons won't shrivel up and die like the older ones.
  191. @216

    So instead of you and I continuing to go round and round, let me hear your solutions. Lawfare? The courts are against us and the people who appoint judges are against us. Retweets? Account suspended. Raising awareness? Cville outcome. Blank white piece of paper? Racist!
     
    Commnity building

    Building an alternative economy

    Yes!

    Little platoons.

    Although, no one who advocates for this can explain how the new little platoons won’t shrivel up and die like the older ones.

  192. @anonymous
    "Speaking of, ratings on who is perceived to be the best on the four most pressing political issues (CNN again):"

    I'm confused. Are

    - The economy
    - Health care
    - The climate crisis
    - Race relations

    the "four most pressing political issues" according to our author, to CNN, or to both? I doubt the people outside Exceptionalia would agree. Nor should conscientious Americans.

    National politics channel, delay, and harmlessly blow off dissent. No matter who wins these meaningless elections, the Establishment wages Big War with our stolen "money." Meanwhile, Americans bleat like sheep, fighting among themselves in the bleachers at the political puppet show.

    CNN.

    • Replies: @anonymous
    Thank you.

    Should people who want change uncritically accept and play sportsball on the Establishment’s home field?

  193. @Jay Fink
    @Thomm

    That 40% figure is surprising to me. My guess is some answer this way to prove a point...to show what loyal WNs they are. It's so hypothetical they can safely answer that way. Yet if they somehow got put in that situation they would choose the black girl over the white dude.

    There are admittedly some things I have in common with white nationalists, though less than I thought after reading this!

    • LOL: Jay Fink
  194. @Achmed E. Newman
    Are you implying that you suspect Mr. Buttigieg may be faking being gay to get the Democrat Party nomination? That would take some real boldness and ingenuity. He could go back into the closet the day after the election and truthfully tell everyone that "this guy is just my roommate, seriously. He's gonna stay on an air mattress in the East Wing for a few months ... I owe him that, at least, since I never consummated ...."

    No, implying is much too strong a characterization–more like I’m wondering why there is no conspiracy around it.

  195. @Truth
    ...Its just that you've set such a high bar, Old Sport.

    Off with the sarcasm!

    • Replies: @Truth
    No, that one was abour 85% realism. I like your stuff generally.
  196. @Feryl
    But populism, the real kind, is too radioactive right now to the Dem base. They want "minority" populism (ya know, only a minority of morons thinks that free college and open borders is a great idea, and stuff like reparations is guaranteed to win approval from self-appointed guardians of "minorities" while alienating everyone else).

    It's ID politics or bust; not only are Dems disinterested in populism, at the moment, but even comfy centrism appears to be on the way out (were this not the case, then Biden and Buttigieg would be doing better, and Sanders would be badly fading; Sanders is still hanging on to some degree, and no amount of "anointing" from the mainstream/Dem establishment is going to propel Biden).

    There was a thought (hope?) that the Dem race would be about the base encouraging a "moderate"/Centrist who could capably take on Trump in the heartland. But those designs have been foiled by the early debates, which became a massive Wokefest that raised the blood pressure of all but the most die-hard ID politics devotees. The base, and the candidates trying to stay in touch with it, are all competing to see who can dis the heartland normies the most. They may not literally say "basket of deplorables", but their supposed policy stances say the same thing. "Purity" (and "virtue") over pragmatism. Like the GOP running a social Darwinist in 1948, or something, to send the message that they weren't being corrupted by New Dealism.

    Great point regarding not literally talking about deplorables but clearly taking digs at them again and again and again. And this is only the first debate, with ten people each–the claws will sink in deeper in future debates when the field narrows.

    • Replies: @Feryl
    Bill Clinton was a terrific politician and personality*, Hilary is raw corruption and ambition with no charm at all.

    Today's leading Dems are better politicians than Hilary (how could they not be?), though I'm not sure how many of them are better people.

    *Bill fought with the sycophants in Hilary's war room, desperately trying to convey to them that the Rust-Belt was a toss-up region that needed more attention. But Bill was a pragmatist who knew how to read an audience and situation.
  197. @Feryl
    I've often said that Whites and East Asians are two sides of the same coin, who basically consider each side to be the same value while not feeling identical to each other.

    But that sentiment isn't exactly reciprocated with other "Caucasian" groups (least of all Southwest Asians), who to some degree evidently don't want a respectful co-existence, or understanding, with whites. I know Derbyshire did a great job explaining this tendency of ethnic groups to become more hostile to each other as they reach greater similarity to each other, though I don't remember his exact explanation for why this happens. E.g., Israeli Jews hate Palestinians, and British Protestants have often been at war with Irish-Catholics, and the stuff between the Chinese and the Japanese. See also "white" Jews in Europe and North America having the greatest enmity toward white gentiles, while almost completely eliding the negative traits of other ethnic groups.

    Occupying the same ecological niche, perhaps? Jews and blacks seem to get along pretty well. Still, in some cases they mesh instead of clashing–there are a lot of (pick 2 of 3) Jewish-Asian-gentile white hybrids floating around the Northeastern upper middle class these days. Not sure why one happens and not the other.

    Didn’t AE show Jewish antigentilism was more of an elite phenomenon than a generally distributed one, a while ago?

    • Replies: @Jay Fink
    "Jews and blacks seem to get along pretty well".

    They vote the same way but they rarely hang out together. Perhaps my experience was atypical but here is how I grew up. My parents had lot's of friends both Jewish and gentile. They got along perfectly fine with gentile whites and thought of them as more similar than not, other than religion. Blacks on the hand were a completely different group they called Schwartzas. The only black I knew was our maid Mary.

    Although I identify more with being non-religious than Jewish I would say 90% of my friends are white non-Jews, partly because I live in an area with few Jews. I get along with gentiles perfectly fine, Some blacks too but I would have nothing in common with the thug types. I am just one individual person but those are my experiences for what their worth.
    , @Feryl
    Occupying the same ecological niche, perhaps?

    Yeah, something like that. Squirrels resent chipmunks for the same reason bears resent cougars; they both have similar skill sets, territory, and goals, thereby increasing competition.
  198. @216

    Not necessary with separate nations. When the US was 85% white, it was dong fine in comparison to China.
     
    Wish fulfillment

    LOL – yeah let’s just throw causality out the window! Let’s just look at the result without examining the process! White criminality, obesity and drug abuse were fractions of what they are now before the 1960’s. Gee, I wonder what changed??? I mean besides just about everything?
     
    Crime, obesity and drugs are personal failures, not systemic failures. We should not copy the worst feaure of black politics: that of claiming helplessness.

    Similarly, by your logic there is no excuse for North Koreans to not be thriving equally to their South Koreans relatives.
     
    There is no excuse for Kim Jong Un to be obese. That more than anything is undermining his negotiating position.

    There is no excuse for Kim Jong Un to be obese. That more than anything is undermining his negotiating position.

    Given he can shoot anyone who looks at him side-eyed, he has little motivation to stay thin…

  199. @Sid
    Buttigieg probably could have passed as straight if he had remained in the closet. Agreed that these types of gays evoke more respect, less disgust from just about everyone.

    Upper middle class bobo SWPLs supported gay marriage in large part to try to not just accept homosexuality, but also to "encourage" gays to act more like straight couples with each other.

    Upper middle class bobo SWPLs supported gay marriage in large part to try to not just accept homosexuality, but also to “encourage” gays to act more like straight couples with each other.

    Homosexual marriage is a way of making homosexuality sound nice. It’s a way of mentally blocking out the reality.

    • Replies: @Talha
    Look, bro - butt-sex enthusiasts also want the right to commit adultery and they simply cannot do that technically if heterosexuals have a monopoly on marriage. Don’t you feel their pain?

    Peace.
    , @Talha
    “However, the article does suggest that examining and following the overall societal patterns of including or excluding trans people within the intimate realm of dating can be used as an indicator of overall acceptance and social inclusion of trans people. In other words, it is one thing to make space for trans people within our workplaces, schools, washrooms, and public spaces, but it is another to see them included within our families and most intimate of spaces, our romantic relationships. We won’t be able to say, as a society, that we are accepting of trans citizens until they are also included within our prospective dating pools; at the very least, on a hypothetical basis.”
    http://www.cambridgeblog.org/2019/06/who-will-date-a-trans-person/

    So remember; if you aren’t willing to go to bed with a guy that has a penis, but claims to be a woman, well you are just a nauseous bigot.

    Also remember; if you aren’t willing to have sex with your pets, you aren’t really accepting of them and may be contributing to an environment of animal cruelty.

    Peace.
  200. @dfordoom

    Upper middle class bobo SWPLs supported gay marriage in large part to try to not just accept homosexuality, but also to “encourage” gays to act more like straight couples with each other.
     
    Homosexual marriage is a way of making homosexuality sound nice. It's a way of mentally blocking out the reality.

    Look, bro – butt-sex enthusiasts also want the right to commit adultery and they simply cannot do that technically if heterosexuals have a monopoly on marriage. Don’t you feel their pain?

    Peace.

  201. @dfordoom

    Upper middle class bobo SWPLs supported gay marriage in large part to try to not just accept homosexuality, but also to “encourage” gays to act more like straight couples with each other.
     
    Homosexual marriage is a way of making homosexuality sound nice. It's a way of mentally blocking out the reality.

    “However, the article does suggest that examining and following the overall societal patterns of including or excluding trans people within the intimate realm of dating can be used as an indicator of overall acceptance and social inclusion of trans people. In other words, it is one thing to make space for trans people within our workplaces, schools, washrooms, and public spaces, but it is another to see them included within our families and most intimate of spaces, our romantic relationships. We won’t be able to say, as a society, that we are accepting of trans citizens until they are also included within our prospective dating pools; at the very least, on a hypothetical basis.”
    http://www.cambridgeblog.org/2019/06/who-will-date-a-trans-person/

    So remember; if you aren’t willing to go to bed with a guy that has a penis, but claims to be a woman, well you are just a nauseous bigot.

    Also remember; if you aren’t willing to have sex with your pets, you aren’t really accepting of them and may be contributing to an environment of animal cruelty.

    Peace.

  202. @Audacious Epigone
    Off with the sarcasm!

    No, that one was abour 85% realism. I like your stuff generally.

  203. @Mr. Rational

    You can’t even get white people to vote for limiting immigration levels
     
    Hogwash.  White people have never been ALLOWED a direct vote on it, and we're at least 70% in favor of slashing or eliminating immigration.  Where we HAVE had votes, like Prop. 187 in California or the Arizona enforcement bill which simply made Federal law into state law as well, the vote was overridden by black-robed tyrants.

    The problem is that we do not have anything resembling a democracy, or even a republic; we are under occupation just as much as the Reconstruction-era South.

    Hogwash. White people have never been ALLOWED a direct vote on it, and we’re at least 70% in favor of slashing or eliminating immigration.

    When people in white countries have been given the opportunity to vote for anti-immigration parties they have consistently failed to do so. There have been such opportunities – the BNP in Britain, One Nation in Australia, AfD in Germany.

    It seems likely that the explanation is that white people don’t like immigration but they don’t consider it to be a vital issue. It seems likely that they prefer to put short-term greed ahead of the long-term future of their nations.

    One has to wonder whether democracy was a good idea.

    • Replies: @Twinkie

    When people in white countries have been given the opportunity to vote for anti-immigration parties they have consistently failed to do so.
     
    That doesn’t change the fact that majorities in those countries favor immigration restriction. The problem is that the so-called anti-immigration parties have been full of unattractive characters who only appeal to the “send all the non-whites back” crowd.

    The solution is rather obvious - we need articulate, clean-cut, intelligent, and church-going family types of candidates who aren’t going to scare off the mainstream voters, including, yes, the upscale segment of the voting public.
  204. @Talha
    Empire must end so people can’t use it for guilt tripping purposes. Unfortunately, many of the same people (not necessarily here in UNZ) who support closing borders, love them some new aircraft careers to kill Persians.

    Peace.

    Empire must end so people can’t use it for guilt tripping purposes. Unfortunately, many of the same people (not necessarily here in UNZ) who support closing borders, love them some new aircraft careers to kill Persians.

    Agreed. And this doesn’t just apply to the U.S. either – the British still haven’t accepted that the British Empire is gone which is why they’re so anxious to tag along every time the American Empire has a new war to fight. Which makes it easy to argue that if the British end up having their country taken away from them it’s just legitimate payback for their imperialism.

    And given just how sleazy and disreputable the history of the British Empire was, anyone making that argument has a point. The British have much to be ashamed of.

    • Replies: @Talha
    Speak of the devil...
    https://twitter.com/AmbJohnBolton/status/1146877026751647756

    Apparently, the Brits feel the EU has jurisdiction over Iran. Weren’t they supposed to not be involved with the EU at this point; where’s Brexit when you need it?

    Peace.
    , @Feryl
    Every empire basically works the same way, although the breadth and longevity may vary. The Anglo countries knew that a common tongue would work in their favor, so they were the quickest to sign up as "allies" (puppets) of the US. As I've often said, the three capitals of America's global empire are Bos-Wash, London, and Tel Aviv.
  205. @dfordoom

    Hogwash. White people have never been ALLOWED a direct vote on it, and we’re at least 70% in favor of slashing or eliminating immigration.
     
    When people in white countries have been given the opportunity to vote for anti-immigration parties they have consistently failed to do so. There have been such opportunities - the BNP in Britain, One Nation in Australia, AfD in Germany.

    It seems likely that the explanation is that white people don't like immigration but they don't consider it to be a vital issue. It seems likely that they prefer to put short-term greed ahead of the long-term future of their nations.

    One has to wonder whether democracy was a good idea.

    When people in white countries have been given the opportunity to vote for anti-immigration parties they have consistently failed to do so.

    That doesn’t change the fact that majorities in those countries favor immigration restriction. The problem is that the so-called anti-immigration parties have been full of unattractive characters who only appeal to the “send all the non-whites back” crowd.

    The solution is rather obvious – we need articulate, clean-cut, intelligent, and church-going family types of candidates who aren’t going to scare off the mainstream voters, including, yes, the upscale segment of the voting public.

    • Agree: iffen
    • Replies: @dfordoom

    The problem is that the so-called anti-immigration parties have been full of unattractive characters who only appeal to the “send all the non-whites back” crowd.
     
    Yes, that's definitely a problem. I'm not convinced that right-wing anti-immigration parties will ever have much appeal. What else do they offer that ordinary people might be attracted by? And right-wing anti-immigration parties have the major problem that it's the corporate sector that is the single biggest driving force behind high immigration. Free market-loving right-wingers who claim to be against immigration usually turn out to be untrustworthy.

    Immigration restrictionism is more of a natural left-wing cause.

    The solution is rather obvious – we need articulate, clean-cut, intelligent, and church-going family types of candidates who aren’t going to scare off the mainstream voters, including, yes, the upscale segment of the voting public.
     
    Yes, that's plausible. We certainly need candidates who will give the impression of being motivated by something more positive than just hatred of blacks and Muslims. And, in my view, we need candidates who offer a positive vision for the future that isn't based on racial obsessions.
  206. @MikeatMikedotMike
    "I’m an immigration restrictionist, including that from Asia."

    "Restrictionist." So I guess you don't think the entire world should come here. Otherwise, that term is useless because it can be applied relatively. 100 million want to come, but I only allowed 10 million to enter. See? I'm a restrictionist!

    I'm an immigration abolishist. The US does not need, nor can it afford, a single additional individual, from anywhere.

    “Restrictionist.” So I guess you don’t think the entire world should come here. Otherwise, that term is useless because it can be applied relatively. 100 million want to come, but I only allowed 10 million to enter. See? I’m a restrictionist!

    Don’t be a moron. It’s easy to be an absolutist on the Internet.* The more useful question is determining which side of the fence you want people to be. Broadly, there are three groups of voters and interests: 1) people who like the status quo, 2) people who want to increase immigration, and 3) people who want to reduce immigration.

    Do you want to win or do you want to alienate the bulk of no. 3 with your stupid “they have to all go back” fantasy? You have to first get most voters on the restriction side (and make that a political priority). Once that is achieved, the rest is just negotiating. My personal view is that we should dramatically reduce illegal immigration with very tough enforcement AND also significantly curtail legal immigration. Currently we have had roughly 1 million per year for the past decade. I’d like to see that number drop to at least 100,000 – 200,000 per annum. And I also would like to abolish the H1B visas.

    Would further reductions be desirable? I think they would be, but, frankly, even getting to the above scenario would be a near miracle, so debating about how much more at that point is a waste of time and perhaps even counterproductive.

    *I am a 2nd Amendment absolutist. I want suppressed select-fire weapons for everyone. But I’m not going to waste my breath or keystrokes on that fantasy when there are more dire threats and issues at hand. The left beats us by incrementalism, and we would be wise to learn their methodology.

    • Agree: Audacious Epigone
    • Replies: @dfordoom

    Broadly, there are three groups of voters and interests: 1) people who like the status quo, 2) people who want to increase immigration, and 3) people who want to reduce immigration.

    Do you want to win or do you want to alienate the bulk of no. 3 with your stupid “they have to all go back” fantasy?
     
    In general I agree.

    You also have to work on group number 1. You have to work on gradually introducing them to the idea that a lot of things that are bad at the moment are actually made much worse by too much immigration - things like overcrowded cities, declining quality of life, low wages, poor working conditions, insufficient jobs (mostly a lack of decent permanent well-paid jobs), high electricity prices, slowly deteriorating infrastructure.

    If you push moderate-sounding non-racial arguments you also make it easier to get group number 3 motivated - you're showing them that you can be in favour of immigration restriction without having any dislike for any racial group.

    When people make the “they have to all go back" argument it usually means they've given up on reality and they've decided to live in a comforting fantasy world. Very much like the "guns will allow us to overthrow the evil commie government" crowd.
    , @MikeatMikedotMike
    "Don’t be a moron. It’s easy to be an absolutist on the Internet.* The more useful question is determining which side of the fence you want people to be. Broadly, there are three groups of voters and interests: 1) people who like the status quo, 2) people who want to increase immigration, and 3) people who want to reduce immigration. "

    It is amusing to observe you continually pat yourself on the back about how great of a human being you are when you're almost always the one to start lobbing insults when you get your feelings hurt. As far as the internet, it's even easier for people to concoct gushing chronicles about themselves without fear of discovery.

    "Do you want to win or do you want to alienate the bulk of no. 3 with your stupid “they have to all go back” fantasy? You have to first get most voters on the restriction side (and make that a political priority). Once that is achieved, the rest is just negotiating. "

    Who exactly is dealing in fantasy? We are so far past the possibility of what you are dreaming about that I feel embarrassed for you. Mr. Rational mentioned Prop 187 in an earlier comment. I was living in LA when that prop passed and was immediately blocked by the courts. That was 25 years ago. We'll never get that close to an immigration win again. So I fully realize everything I propose will never happen. That makes me a lot more based in reality than you seem to be.

    "But I’m not going to waste my breath or keystrokes on that fantasy when there are more dire threats and issues at hand.

    Don't kid yourself pal. They're all wasted keystrokes. All we do here is analyze data and current events or offer our own theories on how to save the Republic, anonymously. It's not quite literally reshuffling deck chairs, but it's close. But I guess some people's delusions of grandeur are grander than others'.
    , @Feryl

    Currently we have had roughly 1 million per year for the past decade.
     
    Akshully, that's been the case since GHW Bush in 1989, with the only real reductions occurring from about 1993-1995 (that was the period when immigration control became briefly mainstream among both parties) and from 2002-2004 (post 9/11).
  207. @Twinkie

    When people in white countries have been given the opportunity to vote for anti-immigration parties they have consistently failed to do so.
     
    That doesn’t change the fact that majorities in those countries favor immigration restriction. The problem is that the so-called anti-immigration parties have been full of unattractive characters who only appeal to the “send all the non-whites back” crowd.

    The solution is rather obvious - we need articulate, clean-cut, intelligent, and church-going family types of candidates who aren’t going to scare off the mainstream voters, including, yes, the upscale segment of the voting public.

    The problem is that the so-called anti-immigration parties have been full of unattractive characters who only appeal to the “send all the non-whites back” crowd.

    Yes, that’s definitely a problem. I’m not convinced that right-wing anti-immigration parties will ever have much appeal. What else do they offer that ordinary people might be attracted by? And right-wing anti-immigration parties have the major problem that it’s the corporate sector that is the single biggest driving force behind high immigration. Free market-loving right-wingers who claim to be against immigration usually turn out to be untrustworthy.

    Immigration restrictionism is more of a natural left-wing cause.

    The solution is rather obvious – we need articulate, clean-cut, intelligent, and church-going family types of candidates who aren’t going to scare off the mainstream voters, including, yes, the upscale segment of the voting public.

    Yes, that’s plausible. We certainly need candidates who will give the impression of being motivated by something more positive than just hatred of blacks and Muslims. And, in my view, we need candidates who offer a positive vision for the future that isn’t based on racial obsessions.

    • Replies: @Feryl

    Yes, that’s definitely a problem. I’m not convinced that right-wing anti-immigration parties will ever have much appeal. What else do they offer that ordinary people might be attracted by? And right-wing anti-immigration parties have the major problem that it’s the corporate sector that is the single biggest driving force behind high immigration. Free market-loving right-wingers who claim to be against immigration usually turn out to be untrustworthy.
     
    Righties will glibly claim that the Left is the biggest booster of immigration, when ironically, the modern Left is merely duplicating what the Right did in the 80's and 90's. It's not "Left" or "Right" that matters, but rather, the degree to which one wishes to stay in the neo-liberal era. Anyone who isn't a partisan retard understands that the New Deal Left kept the borders mostly shut, prevented excessive econ. speculation, and kept gambling, legal narcotics, prostitution, and homosexuality on the margins where these degenerate things belong. The neo-liberal Right, as well as the Leftists converted to neo-liberal norms, wants market de-regulation, open borders, and greater tolerance of degenerate but still profitable products/services (like gambling, legal drugs, and businesses that cater to homosexuals).

    Failure to discern the difference between wholesome FDR-Nixon norms, and toxic Reagan-Trump norms, is the key reason why we can't have more productive talk about our problems and how to fix them. Either we cater to normal people (as Andy Yang calls them), or we celebrate decadent rich people who fail to stigmatize greed and degeneracy. One or the other. It's not about "Left" or "Right" anymore, given that anyone who isn't brain damaged would much rather have FDR or Kennedy in power than they would GW Bush.

  208. @Twinkie

    “Restrictionist.” So I guess you don’t think the entire world should come here. Otherwise, that term is useless because it can be applied relatively. 100 million want to come, but I only allowed 10 million to enter. See? I’m a restrictionist!
     
    Don’t be a moron. It’s easy to be an absolutist on the Internet.* The more useful question is determining which side of the fence you want people to be. Broadly, there are three groups of voters and interests: 1) people who like the status quo, 2) people who want to increase immigration, and 3) people who want to reduce immigration.

    Do you want to win or do you want to alienate the bulk of no. 3 with your stupid “they have to all go back” fantasy? You have to first get most voters on the restriction side (and make that a political priority). Once that is achieved, the rest is just negotiating. My personal view is that we should dramatically reduce illegal immigration with very tough enforcement AND also significantly curtail legal immigration. Currently we have had roughly 1 million per year for the past decade. I’d like to see that number drop to at least 100,000 - 200,000 per annum. And I also would like to abolish the H1B visas.

    Would further reductions be desirable? I think they would be, but, frankly, even getting to the above scenario would be a near miracle, so debating about how much more at that point is a waste of time and perhaps even counterproductive.

    *I am a 2nd Amendment absolutist. I want suppressed select-fire weapons for everyone. But I’m not going to waste my breath or keystrokes on that fantasy when there are more dire threats and issues at hand. The left beats us by incrementalism, and we would be wise to learn their methodology.

    Broadly, there are three groups of voters and interests: 1) people who like the status quo, 2) people who want to increase immigration, and 3) people who want to reduce immigration.

    Do you want to win or do you want to alienate the bulk of no. 3 with your stupid “they have to all go back” fantasy?

    In general I agree.

    You also have to work on group number 1. You have to work on gradually introducing them to the idea that a lot of things that are bad at the moment are actually made much worse by too much immigration – things like overcrowded cities, declining quality of life, low wages, poor working conditions, insufficient jobs (mostly a lack of decent permanent well-paid jobs), high electricity prices, slowly deteriorating infrastructure.

    If you push moderate-sounding non-racial arguments you also make it easier to get group number 3 motivated – you’re showing them that you can be in favour of immigration restriction without having any dislike for any racial group.

    When people make the “they have to all go back” argument it usually means they’ve given up on reality and they’ve decided to live in a comforting fantasy world. Very much like the “guns will allow us to overthrow the evil commie government” crowd.

    • Agree: Twinkie
    • Replies: @iffen
    Excellent comment!

    I want to add my observation that it is pretty obvious that the elites think that they don't really need the lower classes any longer. Globalization has reduced the "value" of national states to their interests and they no longer go through the motions of looking out for the interests of the nation as a whole.

    More of a problem is the fact that consumerism and financial success seem to be the only values that are held in esteem. How much money you have or can make is the only measure of a successful life. I see it in many of the comments here. A large part of the railing against "welfare" (and yes, it is a mess) is because the commenter believes that the recepients get money (sucess) the "wrong" way.

    , @Feryl

    You also have to work on group number 1. You have to work on gradually introducing them to the idea that a lot of things that are bad at the moment are actually made much worse by too much immigration – things like overcrowded cities, declining quality of life, low wages, poor working conditions, insufficient jobs (mostly a lack of decent permanent well-paid jobs), high electricity prices, slowly deteriorating infrastructure.

    If you push moderate-sounding non-racial arguments you also make it easier to get group number 3 motivated – you’re showing them that you can be in favour of immigration restriction without having any dislike for any racial group.
     
    Gilded age norms of hysterical emotionalism and moralism* are going to make it very difficult to intellectually convince people that tight regulation of our affairs (including the borders) is beneficial to us all in the long run. Back in the mid 1920's, people were tiring of Gilded Age chaotic norms, and were starting to listen to reason (so elites agreed to shut immigration off in 1924). But these days we are only about 25 years into the current Gilded Age, which we may have to deal with for at least another 10 years. I've said before that substantial evidence of a shift toward better ideas may not be at hand until the 2030's; be patient.

    *No matter your own tone and ideas, people who aren't inclined to agree with you will scream at you that you're an evil bastard for daring to represent an opposing viewpoint. If you look at New Deal era norms of rhetoric, it was shameful to resort to moralistic cliches and shallowness back then.
  209. @Audacious Epigone
    Tulsi tried. Here's to her continuing to try.

    But she's elegant, composed, and pretty, yet the reaction to her is a big yawn.

    Face it , Audacious, the entire D.N.C is totally down the tubes.

    Their entire crop of nominees are prepackaged corrupt establishment puppets.

    They are nothing more than DNC Hillary “clones” , with Joe and Kamala as “Clone One and Clone Two”…… respectively.

    There is one candidate,…. and one candidate alone ….., who is NOT a Hillary “clone”.

    Tulsi Gabbard.

    She is the ONLY DNC candidate who can crush Trump ….and take the White House.

    The rest….have already lost.

  210. @Twinkie

    “Restrictionist.” So I guess you don’t think the entire world should come here. Otherwise, that term is useless because it can be applied relatively. 100 million want to come, but I only allowed 10 million to enter. See? I’m a restrictionist!
     
    Don’t be a moron. It’s easy to be an absolutist on the Internet.* The more useful question is determining which side of the fence you want people to be. Broadly, there are three groups of voters and interests: 1) people who like the status quo, 2) people who want to increase immigration, and 3) people who want to reduce immigration.

    Do you want to win or do you want to alienate the bulk of no. 3 with your stupid “they have to all go back” fantasy? You have to first get most voters on the restriction side (and make that a political priority). Once that is achieved, the rest is just negotiating. My personal view is that we should dramatically reduce illegal immigration with very tough enforcement AND also significantly curtail legal immigration. Currently we have had roughly 1 million per year for the past decade. I’d like to see that number drop to at least 100,000 - 200,000 per annum. And I also would like to abolish the H1B visas.

    Would further reductions be desirable? I think they would be, but, frankly, even getting to the above scenario would be a near miracle, so debating about how much more at that point is a waste of time and perhaps even counterproductive.

    *I am a 2nd Amendment absolutist. I want suppressed select-fire weapons for everyone. But I’m not going to waste my breath or keystrokes on that fantasy when there are more dire threats and issues at hand. The left beats us by incrementalism, and we would be wise to learn their methodology.

    “Don’t be a moron. It’s easy to be an absolutist on the Internet.* The more useful question is determining which side of the fence you want people to be. Broadly, there are three groups of voters and interests: 1) people who like the status quo, 2) people who want to increase immigration, and 3) people who want to reduce immigration. ”

    It is amusing to observe you continually pat yourself on the back about how great of a human being you are when you’re almost always the one to start lobbing insults when you get your feelings hurt. As far as the internet, it’s even easier for people to concoct gushing chronicles about themselves without fear of discovery.

    “Do you want to win or do you want to alienate the bulk of no. 3 with your stupid “they have to all go back” fantasy? You have to first get most voters on the restriction side (and make that a political priority). Once that is achieved, the rest is just negotiating. ”

    Who exactly is dealing in fantasy? We are so far past the possibility of what you are dreaming about that I feel embarrassed for you. Mr. Rational mentioned Prop 187 in an earlier comment. I was living in LA when that prop passed and was immediately blocked by the courts. That was 25 years ago. We’ll never get that close to an immigration win again. So I fully realize everything I propose will never happen. That makes me a lot more based in reality than you seem to be.

    “But I’m not going to waste my breath or keystrokes on that fantasy when there are more dire threats and issues at hand.

    Don’t kid yourself pal. They’re all wasted keystrokes. All we do here is analyze data and current events or offer our own theories on how to save the Republic, anonymously. It’s not quite literally reshuffling deck chairs, but it’s close. But I guess some people’s delusions of grandeur are grander than others’.

    • Replies: @Twinkie

    It is amusing to observe you continually pat yourself on the back about how great of a human being you are when you’re almost always the one to start lobbing insults when you get your feelings hurt.
     
    This is just a non sequitur evasion of the fact that the nonsense you attribute to me - my supposedly wanting millions more of immigrants here - is a straw man and wrong. My feelings aren’t hurt (more projection) - I’m just irritated by your transparent stupidity.

    That makes me a lot more based in reality than you seem to be.
     
    I don’t know what that means and do not care. Go have at it with your defeatist doom masturbation. Just don’t make up lies about what I wrote and believe in order to convince yourself of your own doom fantasy.
  211. @dfordoom

    Empire must end so people can’t use it for guilt tripping purposes. Unfortunately, many of the same people (not necessarily here in UNZ) who support closing borders, love them some new aircraft careers to kill Persians.
     
    Agreed. And this doesn't just apply to the U.S. either - the British still haven't accepted that the British Empire is gone which is why they're so anxious to tag along every time the American Empire has a new war to fight. Which makes it easy to argue that if the British end up having their country taken away from them it's just legitimate payback for their imperialism.

    And given just how sleazy and disreputable the history of the British Empire was, anyone making that argument has a point. The British have much to be ashamed of.

    Speak of the devil…

    Apparently, the Brits feel the EU has jurisdiction over Iran. Weren’t they supposed to not be involved with the EU at this point; where’s Brexit when you need it?

    Peace.

  212. @dfordoom

    Broadly, there are three groups of voters and interests: 1) people who like the status quo, 2) people who want to increase immigration, and 3) people who want to reduce immigration.

    Do you want to win or do you want to alienate the bulk of no. 3 with your stupid “they have to all go back” fantasy?
     
    In general I agree.

    You also have to work on group number 1. You have to work on gradually introducing them to the idea that a lot of things that are bad at the moment are actually made much worse by too much immigration - things like overcrowded cities, declining quality of life, low wages, poor working conditions, insufficient jobs (mostly a lack of decent permanent well-paid jobs), high electricity prices, slowly deteriorating infrastructure.

    If you push moderate-sounding non-racial arguments you also make it easier to get group number 3 motivated - you're showing them that you can be in favour of immigration restriction without having any dislike for any racial group.

    When people make the “they have to all go back" argument it usually means they've given up on reality and they've decided to live in a comforting fantasy world. Very much like the "guns will allow us to overthrow the evil commie government" crowd.

    Excellent comment!

    I want to add my observation that it is pretty obvious that the elites think that they don’t really need the lower classes any longer. Globalization has reduced the “value” of national states to their interests and they no longer go through the motions of looking out for the interests of the nation as a whole.

    More of a problem is the fact that consumerism and financial success seem to be the only values that are held in esteem. How much money you have or can make is the only measure of a successful life. I see it in many of the comments here. A large part of the railing against “welfare” (and yes, it is a mess) is because the commenter believes that the recepients get money (sucess) the “wrong” way.

    • Replies: @dfordoom

    More of a problem is the fact that consumerism and financial success seem to be the only values that are held in esteem. How much money you have or can make is the only measure of a successful life. I see it in many of the comments here. A large part of the railing against “welfare” (and yes, it is a mess) is because the commenter believes that the recepients get money (sucess) the “wrong” way.
     
    It's interesting that the counterculture of the late 60s/early 70s seemed to be questioning the idea of a society based entirely on consumerism and financial success. But that was coming uncomfortably close to questioning the whole basis of capitalism so the counterculture got steered away from wicked anti-capitalist thoughts into nice safe identity politics thoughts. Stop attacking rich bankers and start attacking the patriarchy instead.

    What's intriguing is that nobody really seems to have noticed. The entire Left as it had historically existed, based on a critical view of capitalism, simply vanished and was replaced by a new Left that thought capitalism was absolutely awesome. It was one of the most significant political revolutions in history and nobody noticed.
    , @Feryl
    I see it in many of the comments here. A large part of the railing against “welfare” (and yes, it is a mess) is because the commenter believes that the recepients get money (sucess) the “wrong” way.

    Since the 70's it's been common to say "I want all the money I can hang onto", because the assumption is that other people are worthless and stupid, and there's no moral imperative to try and extend them a hand, since they chose to have these problems and it's a big waste to try and rescue them.

    That this mentality flies totally in the face of the humane and compassionate culture of the 1930's-1960's (when the mentality was that "we're all on this together" and all for one, one for all) is generally ignored.
  213. anonymous[340] • Disclaimer says:
    @Audacious Epigone
    CNN.

    Thank you.

    Should people who want change uncritically accept and play sportsball on the Establishment’s home field?

  214. @iffen
    Excellent comment!

    I want to add my observation that it is pretty obvious that the elites think that they don't really need the lower classes any longer. Globalization has reduced the "value" of national states to their interests and they no longer go through the motions of looking out for the interests of the nation as a whole.

    More of a problem is the fact that consumerism and financial success seem to be the only values that are held in esteem. How much money you have or can make is the only measure of a successful life. I see it in many of the comments here. A large part of the railing against "welfare" (and yes, it is a mess) is because the commenter believes that the recepients get money (sucess) the "wrong" way.

    More of a problem is the fact that consumerism and financial success seem to be the only values that are held in esteem. How much money you have or can make is the only measure of a successful life. I see it in many of the comments here. A large part of the railing against “welfare” (and yes, it is a mess) is because the commenter believes that the recepients get money (sucess) the “wrong” way.

    It’s interesting that the counterculture of the late 60s/early 70s seemed to be questioning the idea of a society based entirely on consumerism and financial success. But that was coming uncomfortably close to questioning the whole basis of capitalism so the counterculture got steered away from wicked anti-capitalist thoughts into nice safe identity politics thoughts. Stop attacking rich bankers and start attacking the patriarchy instead.

    What’s intriguing is that nobody really seems to have noticed. The entire Left as it had historically existed, based on a critical view of capitalism, simply vanished and was replaced by a new Left that thought capitalism was absolutely awesome. It was one of the most significant political revolutions in history and nobody noticed.

    • Replies: @iffen
    counterculture got steered away from wicked anti-capitalist thoughts into nice safe identity politics thoughts

    I agree with much of your comment, but I object to using steered as an explanation. I have a lot of trouble understanding the mechanics of cultural change, but I am certain that steered is an incorrect description.

    , @iffen
    The entire Left as it had historically existed, based on a critical view of capitalism, simply vanished and was replaced by a new Left that thought capitalism was absolutely awesome. It was one of the most significant political revolutions in history and nobody noticed.

    How did they switch from anti-war to massive support for endles wars?

    Which, by the way, is another reason the elites don't need the working class anymore. They used to have to work at national unity and gaining support for military actions. They don't even have to lift a finger in that direction anymore.
    , @Feryl
    It's generational; middle-aged Losts and GIs feared unrestrained capitalism, since they grew up partly or entirely in the Gilded Age. Silents and Boomers came of age during the Great Compression (1930-1980), and came to think of market regulation as burdensome and tiring (because, from early Silents to late Boomers, each passing generation had less and less understanding of just how rapacious Social Darwinist capitalism was in the late 19th and early 20th century; this is why the strongest Reaganites were born in the 1960's).

    . The entire Left as it had historically existed, based on a critical view of capitalism,
     
    This critique intensified from about 1900-1970, stagnated in the 70's, and then disappeared from mainstream thought in the 80's and 90's (only a handful of boutique Leftist outlets were openly disparaging capitalism by the late 80's).

    A new development among the modern Left is the attack on mid-century economic Leftism, which is said to be tainted by it's association with the social conservatism of that era*. In other words, economic regulation leads to "backward" cultural regulation and "racism" and "homophobia". Interestingly, though, it was the Reaganites who started this narrative by promising to "de-regulate the markets" which was really code for "de-regulate everything" (including the borders, standards of decency, one's emotions, and all the rest). In the current nadir of the neo-liberal era, the ostensible "Left" has assumed the same stance as the 80's Reaganites: de-regulation is imperative in the effort to make any one person's life better.

    *Modern liberals won't do appeals to populist Trump voters, because Trump voters are crytpo-fascists who beat off to Norman Rockwell paintings.
  215. @dfordoom

    television is immensely powerful but it can’t hide reality forever if that reality keeps getting worse.
     
    That's just the problem. If you control the media, especially if you control both the traditional media and social media (and Woke Capital does control both), then you can hide reality almost indefinitely.

    But the much bigger problem is that there's a very big chunk of white people who are absolutely delighted with the way things are going. Rich whites are delighted. They're getting richer. Upper middle-class whites are delighted with the situation. They have enough money to live in nice comfortable safe whitopias, and they're making lots of money. White Christians are overjoyed by the current situation - so many opportunities for virtue-signalling! Whites who run small businesses are very pleased - they're getting cheap labour. White male homosexuals are delighted - lots of immigrants to exploit sexually. White college students think everything is great because being an SJW is so much fun - much more fun than actually doing your coursework. White bureaucrats are happy - never have so many bureaucrats been needed!

    None of these white people could care less if in the long term society goes down the toilet. So you don't even need to hide reality from these people. As far as these white people are concerned, as long as only poorer whites are paying the price for gradual social disintegration they just don't care. In fact they're quite pleased to see poor white people suffering.

    But the much bigger problem is that there’s a very big chunk of white people who are absolutely delighted with the way things are going. Rich whites are delighted. They’re getting richer. Upper middle-class whites are delighted with the situation. They have enough money to live in nice comfortable safe whitopias, and they’re making lots of money.

    I don’t think anyone is that happy right now (according to Peter Turchin, Americans felt better as time went on from 1900-1960, and have been feeling more and more discouraged since 1961). Rather, I think that what the upper classes perceive to be both the problem and the solution are vastly different from what lower class native born people think. For example, most “true” elites (as defined by lots of education and paying tons of money to live in a fashionable area) these days aren’t embarrassed to blow tons of cash on status items; back in the New Deal era, this sort of consumption was considered very shameful, because it was understood that it could stir discontent among the lower class (who might feel as if the money being squandered ought to go toward more pro-social things like higher wages). Elites for the last 40 years have largely agreed that it’s ok to slash taxes on rich people, and plow tons of money into the stock market/real estate* and conspicuous consumption, rather than the Keynesian/New Deal approach of having elites shoulder more of the tax burden, while they devote their earnings toward investment in things like manufacturing capacity, infrastructure, and better treatment of workers.

    *America is more expensive than ever to live in, in large part due to fiscal policies (debt-based economy) that encourage irresponsible (but elite friendly) cost inflation of stuff like rent, property, medical bills, and education costs. No healthy, viable in the long-term economy should be based on elites profiteering from expenses that have been jacked up so high that vast numbers of mid-lower class American must resort to indebting themselves to get by.

    Every econ. “boom” since the mid-80’s keeps going to a smaller and smaller share of the population. That’s because wages are stagnant, and living expenses keep going up; few people have investments in the real estate market and stock market, but those who do have been flying high since 1984.

    White Christians are overjoyed by the current situation – so many opportunities for virtue-signalling! Whites who run small businesses are very pleased – they’re getting cheap labour. White male homosexuals are delighted – lots of immigrants to exploit sexually. White college students think everything is great because being an SJW is so much fun – much more fun than actually doing your coursework. White bureaucrats are happy – never have so many bureaucrats been needed!

    It took a while, but Xtiandom is basically dying off, relative to what it was in the 90’s (or prior decades). Europeans lost interest in the mid-20th century, and North Americans have lost interest in the early 21st century.

    Most gays are apathetic toward politics. Today’s college students are about the most miserable class of people you could imagine, as stress and anxiety have been recorded at very high levels. Living in a Gilded Age really is just not much fun for anyone; lower class people just scrape by (if they manage to stay off the street or out of prison), while upper class people are constantly arguing, back stabbing, and nervous that they could be knocked off their perch by fellow elites or populist revolutionaries.

    • Replies: @iffen
    and nervous that they could be knocked off their perch by fellow elites or populist revolutionaries.

    They don't look all that nervous to me and I don't see any reason that they should be.
    , @Feryl
    The marriage rate of twenty-something whites collapsed in the late 90's, and that chart ought to tell you why (and the fact that whites born before 1973 lean much more Republican ought to tell you something, too). Whites born after 1972 are not getting married and not having kids like older generations of whites did. If you entered the workforce after 1990, your economic prospects appear to be substantially worse than older generation.

    I strongly suspect that it will be up to late X-ers and Millennials to finally give us economic populism, since older generations will always blow smoke that "hard work" is always be justly rewarded. That's bull-shit, but people who grew up in the 1940's-1970's just don't get it the way us younger people do.
    , @Feryl
    Social Darwinist morons like Stefan Molyneux (born in 1966, too old to understand what younger generations have gone through) claim that it's a Leftist myth that elites who pad their incomes can only due so by taking resources away from the lower class. Yet that income distribution chart literally shows that the top elite got richer by about 10%, while the lower class got poorer by about 10%. In other words: gains by one group always result in losses by another. Back in the 1980's, the "trickle down" theory of economics gained momentum: it was no longer necessary to enforce New Deal equality measures, because "unleashing" the full power of de-regulated private sector actors would thus create prosperity that would be passed down to the lower classes. Back in the real world, no such happened: since the 80's, every passing decade has seen greater attempts by the elite to glom onto as much as they can, while ordinary people have a harder and harder time staying out of debt.

    Many people never really bought into trickle down theory, of course, but there was never enough substantial and effective opposition to stop it from infecting us over the last 40 years. The thing is, in the New Deal era we had enough competent and modest elites that we were able to rein in our worst impulses and do what was best for all of us in the long run. But that stability and security was thrown away in the 80's, so that a relative handful of big winners could arrogantly live above the concerns of ordinary people.
    , @dfordoom

    while upper class people are constantly arguing, back stabbing, and nervous that they could be knocked off their perch by fellow elites or populist revolutionaries.
     
    I hadn't heard that there was an epidemic of depression among billionaires. Most billionaires today look pretty damned happy to me. And they look hyper-confident.
  216. @Feryl

    But the much bigger problem is that there’s a very big chunk of white people who are absolutely delighted with the way things are going. Rich whites are delighted. They’re getting richer. Upper middle-class whites are delighted with the situation. They have enough money to live in nice comfortable safe whitopias, and they’re making lots of money.
     
    '

    I don't think anyone is that happy right now (according to Peter Turchin, Americans felt better as time went on from 1900-1960, and have been feeling more and more discouraged since 1961). Rather, I think that what the upper classes perceive to be both the problem and the solution are vastly different from what lower class native born people think. For example, most "true" elites (as defined by lots of education and paying tons of money to live in a fashionable area) these days aren't embarrassed to blow tons of cash on status items; back in the New Deal era, this sort of consumption was considered very shameful, because it was understood that it could stir discontent among the lower class (who might feel as if the money being squandered ought to go toward more pro-social things like higher wages). Elites for the last 40 years have largely agreed that it's ok to slash taxes on rich people, and plow tons of money into the stock market/real estate* and conspicuous consumption, rather than the Keynesian/New Deal approach of having elites shoulder more of the tax burden, while they devote their earnings toward investment in things like manufacturing capacity, infrastructure, and better treatment of workers.

    *America is more expensive than ever to live in, in large part due to fiscal policies (debt-based economy) that encourage irresponsible (but elite friendly) cost inflation of stuff like rent, property, medical bills, and education costs. No healthy, viable in the long-term economy should be based on elites profiteering from expenses that have been jacked up so high that vast numbers of mid-lower class American must resort to indebting themselves to get by.

    https://pixel.nymag.com/imgs/daily/intelligencer/2017/12/14/14-inequality-1.nocrop.w710.h2147483647.png

    Every econ. "boom" since the mid-80's keeps going to a smaller and smaller share of the population. That's because wages are stagnant, and living expenses keep going up; few people have investments in the real estate market and stock market, but those who do have been flying high since 1984.

    White Christians are overjoyed by the current situation – so many opportunities for virtue-signalling! Whites who run small businesses are very pleased – they’re getting cheap labour. White male homosexuals are delighted – lots of immigrants to exploit sexually. White college students think everything is great because being an SJW is so much fun – much more fun than actually doing your coursework. White bureaucrats are happy – never have so many bureaucrats been needed!
     
    It took a while, but Xtiandom is basically dying off, relative to what it was in the 90's (or prior decades). Europeans lost interest in the mid-20th century, and North Americans have lost interest in the early 21st century.

    Most gays are apathetic toward politics. Today's college students are about the most miserable class of people you could imagine, as stress and anxiety have been recorded at very high levels. Living in a Gilded Age really is just not much fun for anyone; lower class people just scrape by (if they manage to stay off the street or out of prison), while upper class people are constantly arguing, back stabbing, and nervous that they could be knocked off their perch by fellow elites or populist revolutionaries.

    and nervous that they could be knocked off their perch by fellow elites or populist revolutionaries.

    They don’t look all that nervous to me and I don’t see any reason that they should be.

    • Replies: @Feryl
    Elites in the 1950's often built rather small homes, and to some degree began to forsake the vast crews of servants that elites in Gilded Ages can't get enough of. I saw a blog post that mentioned an article in a 1950's magazine that talked about elites "down-sizing" their appetites and life-styles. What made the 1950's so great was how noncompetitive people were; The Boomer Reaganites never shut up, ever, about the glory of cut-throat competition, but given their own childhoods you would think they would appreciate a stable, low-key, modest life. But nope, everything about the New Deal era, pro or con, had to be flushed down the historical tubes.

    Modern elites often yell in public, act highly emotional, and use foul language and ad hominem abusive rhetoric. This is representative of modern elites being unhappy, ruthless, insecure, and defensive; they want to have as much as they can get, any way they can get it, and don't wan't anyone else threatening what they've "worked so hard" to obtain. This sort of competitive mania and insecurity also has infected society with lots of harsh hazing, infighting, bullying, workplace shootings, and suicides. No class in America right now is mentally sound and well-adjusted. Back when this sort of hyper-competitiveness and emotionalism initially appeared in the mid-80's, it was often recognized and lamented; by the 2010's, it's taken to be BAU, and we often fail to recognize it and condemn it for being the shallow and cruel culture that it is.
  217. @dfordoom

    More of a problem is the fact that consumerism and financial success seem to be the only values that are held in esteem. How much money you have or can make is the only measure of a successful life. I see it in many of the comments here. A large part of the railing against “welfare” (and yes, it is a mess) is because the commenter believes that the recepients get money (sucess) the “wrong” way.
     
    It's interesting that the counterculture of the late 60s/early 70s seemed to be questioning the idea of a society based entirely on consumerism and financial success. But that was coming uncomfortably close to questioning the whole basis of capitalism so the counterculture got steered away from wicked anti-capitalist thoughts into nice safe identity politics thoughts. Stop attacking rich bankers and start attacking the patriarchy instead.

    What's intriguing is that nobody really seems to have noticed. The entire Left as it had historically existed, based on a critical view of capitalism, simply vanished and was replaced by a new Left that thought capitalism was absolutely awesome. It was one of the most significant political revolutions in history and nobody noticed.

    counterculture got steered away from wicked anti-capitalist thoughts into nice safe identity politics thoughts

    I agree with much of your comment, but I object to using steered as an explanation. I have a lot of trouble understanding the mechanics of cultural change, but I am certain that steered is an incorrect description.

    • Replies: @dfordoom


    counterculture got steered away from wicked anti-capitalist thoughts into nice safe identity politics thoughts
     
    I agree with much of your comment, but I object to using steered as an explanation. I have a lot of trouble understanding the mechanics of cultural change, but I am certain that steered is an incorrect description.
     
    I'm not absolutely certain of the mechanisms either. And I'm not sure exactly why the counterculture fell in love with capitalism.

    But I do think there has been some steering going on. If you take the example of Australia, suddenly in the 80s the Australian Labor Party was getting massive support from the corporate sector. And this was at the precise moment that Labor suddenly decided to abandon socialism and begin pursuing right-wing pro-capitalist policies.

    It was about the same time that environmental groups suddenly started to be swimming in corporate money. And lots of corporate money was going into universities.

    Maybe steering is the wrong word. Maybe bribing would be more accurate.

    But I agree that the mechanisms of cultural change are murky. Maybe there were some genuine conversion experiences. Maybe there were fat cigar-chomping capitalists meeting in darkened room and plotting to buy the Left. Maybe it was a bit of both.
  218. @dfordoom

    More of a problem is the fact that consumerism and financial success seem to be the only values that are held in esteem. How much money you have or can make is the only measure of a successful life. I see it in many of the comments here. A large part of the railing against “welfare” (and yes, it is a mess) is because the commenter believes that the recepients get money (sucess) the “wrong” way.
     
    It's interesting that the counterculture of the late 60s/early 70s seemed to be questioning the idea of a society based entirely on consumerism and financial success. But that was coming uncomfortably close to questioning the whole basis of capitalism so the counterculture got steered away from wicked anti-capitalist thoughts into nice safe identity politics thoughts. Stop attacking rich bankers and start attacking the patriarchy instead.

    What's intriguing is that nobody really seems to have noticed. The entire Left as it had historically existed, based on a critical view of capitalism, simply vanished and was replaced by a new Left that thought capitalism was absolutely awesome. It was one of the most significant political revolutions in history and nobody noticed.

    The entire Left as it had historically existed, based on a critical view of capitalism, simply vanished and was replaced by a new Left that thought capitalism was absolutely awesome. It was one of the most significant political revolutions in history and nobody noticed.

    How did they switch from anti-war to massive support for endles wars?

    Which, by the way, is another reason the elites don’t need the working class anymore. They used to have to work at national unity and gaining support for military actions. They don’t even have to lift a finger in that direction anymore.

    • Replies: @dfordoom


    The entire Left as it had historically existed, based on a critical view of capitalism, simply vanished and was replaced by a new Left that thought capitalism was absolutely awesome. It was one of the most significant political revolutions in history and nobody noticed.
     
    How did they switch from anti-war to massive support for endles wars?
     
    Vietnam was unusual in being an unpopular war with liberals. Liberals were very very enthusiastic about WW2. Leftists and liberals always liked the idea of imposing their ideology on other countries at the point of a gun.

    There was one reason and one reason only for the antiwar movement of the 60s. Middle-class college kids feared that they personally might be asked to fight in Vietnam. They would have been absolutely cool with the war had it been fought by a volunteer army, in other words by the poor.

    If you look at the U.S., the Democrats were responsible for getting the U.S. into both world wars plus Korea plus Vietnam. In the postwar period the Administrations that were keen to avoid war were the Eisenhower and Nixon Administrations which inherited wars and brought them to an end. So the really puzzling change was the sudden enthusiasm for war among Republicans. That seemed to start with Reagan. Which was about the time that Republicans ceased to be conservative and became liberals ands neocons.

    That was a definite ideological change, from a conservative scepticism about the wisdom of foreign wars to a rabid enthusiasm for using war to promote liberalism globally.
  219. @MikeatMikedotMike
    "Don’t be a moron. It’s easy to be an absolutist on the Internet.* The more useful question is determining which side of the fence you want people to be. Broadly, there are three groups of voters and interests: 1) people who like the status quo, 2) people who want to increase immigration, and 3) people who want to reduce immigration. "

    It is amusing to observe you continually pat yourself on the back about how great of a human being you are when you're almost always the one to start lobbing insults when you get your feelings hurt. As far as the internet, it's even easier for people to concoct gushing chronicles about themselves without fear of discovery.

    "Do you want to win or do you want to alienate the bulk of no. 3 with your stupid “they have to all go back” fantasy? You have to first get most voters on the restriction side (and make that a political priority). Once that is achieved, the rest is just negotiating. "

    Who exactly is dealing in fantasy? We are so far past the possibility of what you are dreaming about that I feel embarrassed for you. Mr. Rational mentioned Prop 187 in an earlier comment. I was living in LA when that prop passed and was immediately blocked by the courts. That was 25 years ago. We'll never get that close to an immigration win again. So I fully realize everything I propose will never happen. That makes me a lot more based in reality than you seem to be.

    "But I’m not going to waste my breath or keystrokes on that fantasy when there are more dire threats and issues at hand.

    Don't kid yourself pal. They're all wasted keystrokes. All we do here is analyze data and current events or offer our own theories on how to save the Republic, anonymously. It's not quite literally reshuffling deck chairs, but it's close. But I guess some people's delusions of grandeur are grander than others'.

    It is amusing to observe you continually pat yourself on the back about how great of a human being you are when you’re almost always the one to start lobbing insults when you get your feelings hurt.

    This is just a non sequitur evasion of the fact that the nonsense you attribute to me – my supposedly wanting millions more of immigrants here – is a straw man and wrong. My feelings aren’t hurt (more projection) – I’m just irritated by your transparent stupidity.

    That makes me a lot more based in reality than you seem to be.

    I don’t know what that means and do not care. Go have at it with your defeatist doom masturbation. Just don’t make up lies about what I wrote and believe in order to convince yourself of your own doom fantasy.

    • Replies: @MikeatMikedotMike
    " I’m just irritated by your transparent stupidity."

    LOL - No evasion, it's a straigh forward observation. If anyone is evading, it's you. What exactly do you mean by "restrictionist?" Because sorry Thomm (i'm sorry did I just call you Thomm? my mistake!) but that term doesn't mean shit without context, as I pointed out. The calling me stupid, other than stereotypically unoriginal, is further evasion. Man the fuck up and define your position. How many immigrants do you want? Where should they live? How many get to live in that super strong white enclave you're always bragging about?

    "I don’t know what that means and do not care."

    Maybe you're not as smart as you think.

    "Go have at it with your defeatist doom masturbation."

    The only thing prohibiting you from seeing that the US is lost is your own unsubstantiated arrogance.
  220. @HBS
    The more lethal picks for VP that Harris could make is either Sen. Bob Casey or Gov. Tom Wolf both of Pennsylvania.

    Yup.

    Harris just needs a white cuck as VP. They are a dime a dozen…

  221. @Feryl

    But the much bigger problem is that there’s a very big chunk of white people who are absolutely delighted with the way things are going. Rich whites are delighted. They’re getting richer. Upper middle-class whites are delighted with the situation. They have enough money to live in nice comfortable safe whitopias, and they’re making lots of money.
     
    '

    I don't think anyone is that happy right now (according to Peter Turchin, Americans felt better as time went on from 1900-1960, and have been feeling more and more discouraged since 1961). Rather, I think that what the upper classes perceive to be both the problem and the solution are vastly different from what lower class native born people think. For example, most "true" elites (as defined by lots of education and paying tons of money to live in a fashionable area) these days aren't embarrassed to blow tons of cash on status items; back in the New Deal era, this sort of consumption was considered very shameful, because it was understood that it could stir discontent among the lower class (who might feel as if the money being squandered ought to go toward more pro-social things like higher wages). Elites for the last 40 years have largely agreed that it's ok to slash taxes on rich people, and plow tons of money into the stock market/real estate* and conspicuous consumption, rather than the Keynesian/New Deal approach of having elites shoulder more of the tax burden, while they devote their earnings toward investment in things like manufacturing capacity, infrastructure, and better treatment of workers.

    *America is more expensive than ever to live in, in large part due to fiscal policies (debt-based economy) that encourage irresponsible (but elite friendly) cost inflation of stuff like rent, property, medical bills, and education costs. No healthy, viable in the long-term economy should be based on elites profiteering from expenses that have been jacked up so high that vast numbers of mid-lower class American must resort to indebting themselves to get by.

    https://pixel.nymag.com/imgs/daily/intelligencer/2017/12/14/14-inequality-1.nocrop.w710.h2147483647.png

    Every econ. "boom" since the mid-80's keeps going to a smaller and smaller share of the population. That's because wages are stagnant, and living expenses keep going up; few people have investments in the real estate market and stock market, but those who do have been flying high since 1984.

    White Christians are overjoyed by the current situation – so many opportunities for virtue-signalling! Whites who run small businesses are very pleased – they’re getting cheap labour. White male homosexuals are delighted – lots of immigrants to exploit sexually. White college students think everything is great because being an SJW is so much fun – much more fun than actually doing your coursework. White bureaucrats are happy – never have so many bureaucrats been needed!
     
    It took a while, but Xtiandom is basically dying off, relative to what it was in the 90's (or prior decades). Europeans lost interest in the mid-20th century, and North Americans have lost interest in the early 21st century.

    Most gays are apathetic toward politics. Today's college students are about the most miserable class of people you could imagine, as stress and anxiety have been recorded at very high levels. Living in a Gilded Age really is just not much fun for anyone; lower class people just scrape by (if they manage to stay off the street or out of prison), while upper class people are constantly arguing, back stabbing, and nervous that they could be knocked off their perch by fellow elites or populist revolutionaries.

    The marriage rate of twenty-something whites collapsed in the late 90’s, and that chart ought to tell you why (and the fact that whites born before 1973 lean much more Republican ought to tell you something, too). Whites born after 1972 are not getting married and not having kids like older generations of whites did. If you entered the workforce after 1990, your economic prospects appear to be substantially worse than older generation.

    I strongly suspect that it will be up to late X-ers and Millennials to finally give us economic populism, since older generations will always blow smoke that “hard work” is always be justly rewarded. That’s bull-shit, but people who grew up in the 1940’s-1970’s just don’t get it the way us younger people do.

  222. @Feryl

    But the much bigger problem is that there’s a very big chunk of white people who are absolutely delighted with the way things are going. Rich whites are delighted. They’re getting richer. Upper middle-class whites are delighted with the situation. They have enough money to live in nice comfortable safe whitopias, and they’re making lots of money.
     
    '

    I don't think anyone is that happy right now (according to Peter Turchin, Americans felt better as time went on from 1900-1960, and have been feeling more and more discouraged since 1961). Rather, I think that what the upper classes perceive to be both the problem and the solution are vastly different from what lower class native born people think. For example, most "true" elites (as defined by lots of education and paying tons of money to live in a fashionable area) these days aren't embarrassed to blow tons of cash on status items; back in the New Deal era, this sort of consumption was considered very shameful, because it was understood that it could stir discontent among the lower class (who might feel as if the money being squandered ought to go toward more pro-social things like higher wages). Elites for the last 40 years have largely agreed that it's ok to slash taxes on rich people, and plow tons of money into the stock market/real estate* and conspicuous consumption, rather than the Keynesian/New Deal approach of having elites shoulder more of the tax burden, while they devote their earnings toward investment in things like manufacturing capacity, infrastructure, and better treatment of workers.

    *America is more expensive than ever to live in, in large part due to fiscal policies (debt-based economy) that encourage irresponsible (but elite friendly) cost inflation of stuff like rent, property, medical bills, and education costs. No healthy, viable in the long-term economy should be based on elites profiteering from expenses that have been jacked up so high that vast numbers of mid-lower class American must resort to indebting themselves to get by.

    https://pixel.nymag.com/imgs/daily/intelligencer/2017/12/14/14-inequality-1.nocrop.w710.h2147483647.png

    Every econ. "boom" since the mid-80's keeps going to a smaller and smaller share of the population. That's because wages are stagnant, and living expenses keep going up; few people have investments in the real estate market and stock market, but those who do have been flying high since 1984.

    White Christians are overjoyed by the current situation – so many opportunities for virtue-signalling! Whites who run small businesses are very pleased – they’re getting cheap labour. White male homosexuals are delighted – lots of immigrants to exploit sexually. White college students think everything is great because being an SJW is so much fun – much more fun than actually doing your coursework. White bureaucrats are happy – never have so many bureaucrats been needed!
     
    It took a while, but Xtiandom is basically dying off, relative to what it was in the 90's (or prior decades). Europeans lost interest in the mid-20th century, and North Americans have lost interest in the early 21st century.

    Most gays are apathetic toward politics. Today's college students are about the most miserable class of people you could imagine, as stress and anxiety have been recorded at very high levels. Living in a Gilded Age really is just not much fun for anyone; lower class people just scrape by (if they manage to stay off the street or out of prison), while upper class people are constantly arguing, back stabbing, and nervous that they could be knocked off their perch by fellow elites or populist revolutionaries.

    Social Darwinist morons like Stefan Molyneux (born in 1966, too old to understand what younger generations have gone through) claim that it’s a Leftist myth that elites who pad their incomes can only due so by taking resources away from the lower class. Yet that income distribution chart literally shows that the top elite got richer by about 10%, while the lower class got poorer by about 10%. In other words: gains by one group always result in losses by another. Back in the 1980’s, the “trickle down” theory of economics gained momentum: it was no longer necessary to enforce New Deal equality measures, because “unleashing” the full power of de-regulated private sector actors would thus create prosperity that would be passed down to the lower classes. Back in the real world, no such happened: since the 80’s, every passing decade has seen greater attempts by the elite to glom onto as much as they can, while ordinary people have a harder and harder time staying out of debt.

    Many people never really bought into trickle down theory, of course, but there was never enough substantial and effective opposition to stop it from infecting us over the last 40 years. The thing is, in the New Deal era we had enough competent and modest elites that we were able to rein in our worst impulses and do what was best for all of us in the long run. But that stability and security was thrown away in the 80’s, so that a relative handful of big winners could arrogantly live above the concerns of ordinary people.

    • Replies: @iffen
    Many people never really bought into trickle down theory, of course,

    Some of us know it as the tinkle on down theory.

  223. @Feryl
    Social Darwinist morons like Stefan Molyneux (born in 1966, too old to understand what younger generations have gone through) claim that it's a Leftist myth that elites who pad their incomes can only due so by taking resources away from the lower class. Yet that income distribution chart literally shows that the top elite got richer by about 10%, while the lower class got poorer by about 10%. In other words: gains by one group always result in losses by another. Back in the 1980's, the "trickle down" theory of economics gained momentum: it was no longer necessary to enforce New Deal equality measures, because "unleashing" the full power of de-regulated private sector actors would thus create prosperity that would be passed down to the lower classes. Back in the real world, no such happened: since the 80's, every passing decade has seen greater attempts by the elite to glom onto as much as they can, while ordinary people have a harder and harder time staying out of debt.

    Many people never really bought into trickle down theory, of course, but there was never enough substantial and effective opposition to stop it from infecting us over the last 40 years. The thing is, in the New Deal era we had enough competent and modest elites that we were able to rein in our worst impulses and do what was best for all of us in the long run. But that stability and security was thrown away in the 80's, so that a relative handful of big winners could arrogantly live above the concerns of ordinary people.

    Many people never really bought into trickle down theory, of course,

    Some of us know it as the tinkle on down theory.

    • Replies: @Feryl
    An ideological cycle lasts about 50 years*, so people were going to blow all kinds of smoke in the 80's to try and undermine the New Deal consensus of the 1930's-1970's. Anytime someone tried to defend the New Deal era, they were called a spoil sport, a latent Marxist, and an opponent of "hard work" (because hard work was allegedly discouraged by New Dealism). Besides, New Deal era America was given to Boomers, not created by them, and as such, rising Boomers were going to create something different; I think most people tacitly understood that it wouldn't necessarily be better, but at least it was different. @akinokure.blogspot.com, there's a great article about the Reagan era being fundamentally experimental, since we were blowing up everything that was proven to be of use in the Progressive and New Deal era.

    *The last decade of ideological era will feature extensive criticism of society, which will then give us a subsequent decade where things are done differently. E.g., people began to question the FDR New Deal around 1970, then replaced it in 1980 with Reaganite neo-liberalism. People began to question Social Darwinism around 1920, and replaced it with New Dealism in 1930. People began to question neo-liberalism around 2010, and ideally we will be well on our way to replacing it by 2020.
  224. @iffen
    and nervous that they could be knocked off their perch by fellow elites or populist revolutionaries.

    They don't look all that nervous to me and I don't see any reason that they should be.

    Elites in the 1950’s often built rather small homes, and to some degree began to forsake the vast crews of servants that elites in Gilded Ages can’t get enough of. I saw a blog post that mentioned an article in a 1950’s magazine that talked about elites “down-sizing” their appetites and life-styles. What made the 1950’s so great was how noncompetitive people were; The Boomer Reaganites never shut up, ever, about the glory of cut-throat competition, but given their own childhoods you would think they would appreciate a stable, low-key, modest life. But nope, everything about the New Deal era, pro or con, had to be flushed down the historical tubes.

    Modern elites often yell in public, act highly emotional, and use foul language and ad hominem abusive rhetoric. This is representative of modern elites being unhappy, ruthless, insecure, and defensive; they want to have as much as they can get, any way they can get it, and don’t wan’t anyone else threatening what they’ve “worked so hard” to obtain. This sort of competitive mania and insecurity also has infected society with lots of harsh hazing, infighting, bullying, workplace shootings, and suicides. No class in America right now is mentally sound and well-adjusted. Back when this sort of hyper-competitiveness and emotionalism initially appeared in the mid-80’s, it was often recognized and lamented; by the 2010’s, it’s taken to be BAU, and we often fail to recognize it and condemn it for being the shallow and cruel culture that it is.

  225. @iffen
    Many people never really bought into trickle down theory, of course,

    Some of us know it as the tinkle on down theory.

    An ideological cycle lasts about 50 years*, so people were going to blow all kinds of smoke in the 80’s to try and undermine the New Deal consensus of the 1930’s-1970’s. Anytime someone tried to defend the New Deal era, they were called a spoil sport, a latent Marxist, and an opponent of “hard work” (because hard work was allegedly discouraged by New Dealism). Besides, New Deal era America was given to Boomers, not created by them, and as such, rising Boomers were going to create something different; I think most people tacitly understood that it wouldn’t necessarily be better, but at least it was different. @akinokure.blogspot.com, there’s a great article about the Reagan era being fundamentally experimental, since we were blowing up everything that was proven to be of use in the Progressive and New Deal era.

    *The last decade of ideological era will feature extensive criticism of society, which will then give us a subsequent decade where things are done differently. E.g., people began to question the FDR New Deal around 1970, then replaced it in 1980 with Reaganite neo-liberalism. People began to question Social Darwinism around 1920, and replaced it with New Dealism in 1930. People began to question neo-liberalism around 2010, and ideally we will be well on our way to replacing it by 2020.

    • Replies: @dfordoom

    People began to question neo-liberalism around 2010, and ideally we will be well on our way to replacing it by 2020.
     
    You must be seeing something that I'm not seeing. I see neo-liberalism grinding its few remaining viable enemies into the dirt. You see neo-liberalism on the point of collapse. Curious.
  226. @dfordoom

    More of a problem is the fact that consumerism and financial success seem to be the only values that are held in esteem. How much money you have or can make is the only measure of a successful life. I see it in many of the comments here. A large part of the railing against “welfare” (and yes, it is a mess) is because the commenter believes that the recepients get money (sucess) the “wrong” way.
     
    It's interesting that the counterculture of the late 60s/early 70s seemed to be questioning the idea of a society based entirely on consumerism and financial success. But that was coming uncomfortably close to questioning the whole basis of capitalism so the counterculture got steered away from wicked anti-capitalist thoughts into nice safe identity politics thoughts. Stop attacking rich bankers and start attacking the patriarchy instead.

    What's intriguing is that nobody really seems to have noticed. The entire Left as it had historically existed, based on a critical view of capitalism, simply vanished and was replaced by a new Left that thought capitalism was absolutely awesome. It was one of the most significant political revolutions in history and nobody noticed.

    It’s generational; middle-aged Losts and GIs feared unrestrained capitalism, since they grew up partly or entirely in the Gilded Age. Silents and Boomers came of age during the Great Compression (1930-1980), and came to think of market regulation as burdensome and tiring (because, from early Silents to late Boomers, each passing generation had less and less understanding of just how rapacious Social Darwinist capitalism was in the late 19th and early 20th century; this is why the strongest Reaganites were born in the 1960’s).

    . The entire Left as it had historically existed, based on a critical view of capitalism,

    This critique intensified from about 1900-1970, stagnated in the 70’s, and then disappeared from mainstream thought in the 80’s and 90’s (only a handful of boutique Leftist outlets were openly disparaging capitalism by the late 80’s).

    A new development among the modern Left is the attack on mid-century economic Leftism, which is said to be tainted by it’s association with the social conservatism of that era*. In other words, economic regulation leads to “backward” cultural regulation and “racism” and “homophobia”. Interestingly, though, it was the Reaganites who started this narrative by promising to “de-regulate the markets” which was really code for “de-regulate everything” (including the borders, standards of decency, one’s emotions, and all the rest). In the current nadir of the neo-liberal era, the ostensible “Left” has assumed the same stance as the 80’s Reaganites: de-regulation is imperative in the effort to make any one person’s life better.

    *Modern liberals won’t do appeals to populist Trump voters, because Trump voters are crytpo-fascists who beat off to Norman Rockwell paintings.

  227. @iffen
    Excellent comment!

    I want to add my observation that it is pretty obvious that the elites think that they don't really need the lower classes any longer. Globalization has reduced the "value" of national states to their interests and they no longer go through the motions of looking out for the interests of the nation as a whole.

    More of a problem is the fact that consumerism and financial success seem to be the only values that are held in esteem. How much money you have or can make is the only measure of a successful life. I see it in many of the comments here. A large part of the railing against "welfare" (and yes, it is a mess) is because the commenter believes that the recepients get money (sucess) the "wrong" way.

    I see it in many of the comments here. A large part of the railing against “welfare” (and yes, it is a mess) is because the commenter believes that the recepients get money (sucess) the “wrong” way.

    Since the 70’s it’s been common to say “I want all the money I can hang onto”, because the assumption is that other people are worthless and stupid, and there’s no moral imperative to try and extend them a hand, since they chose to have these problems and it’s a big waste to try and rescue them.

    That this mentality flies totally in the face of the humane and compassionate culture of the 1930’s-1960’s (when the mentality was that “we’re all on this together” and all for one, one for all) is generally ignored.

    • Replies: @iffen
    since they chose to have these problems and it’s a big waste to try and rescue them.

    Assignment of responsibility is a big Gordian knot tar baby. A UBI solves many problems and in particular it skips assigning responsibility entirely. Put everyone at the starting line with the same change purse and let the competition and assorting run wild.
  228. @dfordoom

    Broadly, there are three groups of voters and interests: 1) people who like the status quo, 2) people who want to increase immigration, and 3) people who want to reduce immigration.

    Do you want to win or do you want to alienate the bulk of no. 3 with your stupid “they have to all go back” fantasy?
     
    In general I agree.

    You also have to work on group number 1. You have to work on gradually introducing them to the idea that a lot of things that are bad at the moment are actually made much worse by too much immigration - things like overcrowded cities, declining quality of life, low wages, poor working conditions, insufficient jobs (mostly a lack of decent permanent well-paid jobs), high electricity prices, slowly deteriorating infrastructure.

    If you push moderate-sounding non-racial arguments you also make it easier to get group number 3 motivated - you're showing them that you can be in favour of immigration restriction without having any dislike for any racial group.

    When people make the “they have to all go back" argument it usually means they've given up on reality and they've decided to live in a comforting fantasy world. Very much like the "guns will allow us to overthrow the evil commie government" crowd.

    You also have to work on group number 1. You have to work on gradually introducing them to the idea that a lot of things that are bad at the moment are actually made much worse by too much immigration – things like overcrowded cities, declining quality of life, low wages, poor working conditions, insufficient jobs (mostly a lack of decent permanent well-paid jobs), high electricity prices, slowly deteriorating infrastructure.

    If you push moderate-sounding non-racial arguments you also make it easier to get group number 3 motivated – you’re showing them that you can be in favour of immigration restriction without having any dislike for any racial group.

    Gilded age norms of hysterical emotionalism and moralism* are going to make it very difficult to intellectually convince people that tight regulation of our affairs (including the borders) is beneficial to us all in the long run. Back in the mid 1920’s, people were tiring of Gilded Age chaotic norms, and were starting to listen to reason (so elites agreed to shut immigration off in 1924). But these days we are only about 25 years into the current Gilded Age, which we may have to deal with for at least another 10 years. I’ve said before that substantial evidence of a shift toward better ideas may not be at hand until the 2030’s; be patient.

    *No matter your own tone and ideas, people who aren’t inclined to agree with you will scream at you that you’re an evil bastard for daring to represent an opposing viewpoint. If you look at New Deal era norms of rhetoric, it was shameful to resort to moralistic cliches and shallowness back then.

  229. @dfordoom

    The problem is that the so-called anti-immigration parties have been full of unattractive characters who only appeal to the “send all the non-whites back” crowd.
     
    Yes, that's definitely a problem. I'm not convinced that right-wing anti-immigration parties will ever have much appeal. What else do they offer that ordinary people might be attracted by? And right-wing anti-immigration parties have the major problem that it's the corporate sector that is the single biggest driving force behind high immigration. Free market-loving right-wingers who claim to be against immigration usually turn out to be untrustworthy.

    Immigration restrictionism is more of a natural left-wing cause.

    The solution is rather obvious – we need articulate, clean-cut, intelligent, and church-going family types of candidates who aren’t going to scare off the mainstream voters, including, yes, the upscale segment of the voting public.
     
    Yes, that's plausible. We certainly need candidates who will give the impression of being motivated by something more positive than just hatred of blacks and Muslims. And, in my view, we need candidates who offer a positive vision for the future that isn't based on racial obsessions.

    Yes, that’s definitely a problem. I’m not convinced that right-wing anti-immigration parties will ever have much appeal. What else do they offer that ordinary people might be attracted by? And right-wing anti-immigration parties have the major problem that it’s the corporate sector that is the single biggest driving force behind high immigration. Free market-loving right-wingers who claim to be against immigration usually turn out to be untrustworthy.

    Righties will glibly claim that the Left is the biggest booster of immigration, when ironically, the modern Left is merely duplicating what the Right did in the 80’s and 90’s. It’s not “Left” or “Right” that matters, but rather, the degree to which one wishes to stay in the neo-liberal era. Anyone who isn’t a partisan retard understands that the New Deal Left kept the borders mostly shut, prevented excessive econ. speculation, and kept gambling, legal narcotics, prostitution, and homosexuality on the margins where these degenerate things belong. The neo-liberal Right, as well as the Leftists converted to neo-liberal norms, wants market de-regulation, open borders, and greater tolerance of degenerate but still profitable products/services (like gambling, legal drugs, and businesses that cater to homosexuals).

    Failure to discern the difference between wholesome FDR-Nixon norms, and toxic Reagan-Trump norms, is the key reason why we can’t have more productive talk about our problems and how to fix them. Either we cater to normal people (as Andy Yang calls them), or we celebrate decadent rich people who fail to stigmatize greed and degeneracy. One or the other. It’s not about “Left” or “Right” anymore, given that anyone who isn’t brain damaged would much rather have FDR or Kennedy in power than they would GW Bush.

    • Replies: @Justvisiting
    The old wisdom was "Its the economy stupid." That wisdom had its day. That day is over.

    The new paradigm is not a pretty one, but it is going to be the new reality for a long time.

    "Its race, stupid."

    The concept of the "common good" has become quaint--we have very little in common anymore.
  230. @Feryl

    Yes, that’s definitely a problem. I’m not convinced that right-wing anti-immigration parties will ever have much appeal. What else do they offer that ordinary people might be attracted by? And right-wing anti-immigration parties have the major problem that it’s the corporate sector that is the single biggest driving force behind high immigration. Free market-loving right-wingers who claim to be against immigration usually turn out to be untrustworthy.
     
    Righties will glibly claim that the Left is the biggest booster of immigration, when ironically, the modern Left is merely duplicating what the Right did in the 80's and 90's. It's not "Left" or "Right" that matters, but rather, the degree to which one wishes to stay in the neo-liberal era. Anyone who isn't a partisan retard understands that the New Deal Left kept the borders mostly shut, prevented excessive econ. speculation, and kept gambling, legal narcotics, prostitution, and homosexuality on the margins where these degenerate things belong. The neo-liberal Right, as well as the Leftists converted to neo-liberal norms, wants market de-regulation, open borders, and greater tolerance of degenerate but still profitable products/services (like gambling, legal drugs, and businesses that cater to homosexuals).

    Failure to discern the difference between wholesome FDR-Nixon norms, and toxic Reagan-Trump norms, is the key reason why we can't have more productive talk about our problems and how to fix them. Either we cater to normal people (as Andy Yang calls them), or we celebrate decadent rich people who fail to stigmatize greed and degeneracy. One or the other. It's not about "Left" or "Right" anymore, given that anyone who isn't brain damaged would much rather have FDR or Kennedy in power than they would GW Bush.

    The old wisdom was “Its the economy stupid.” That wisdom had its day. That day is over.

    The new paradigm is not a pretty one, but it is going to be the new reality for a long time.

    “Its race, stupid.”

    The concept of the “common good” has become quaint–we have very little in common anymore.

  231. @SFG
    Occupying the same ecological niche, perhaps? Jews and blacks seem to get along pretty well. Still, in some cases they mesh instead of clashing--there are a lot of (pick 2 of 3) Jewish-Asian-gentile white hybrids floating around the Northeastern upper middle class these days. Not sure why one happens and not the other.

    Didn't AE show Jewish antigentilism was more of an elite phenomenon than a generally distributed one, a while ago?

    “Jews and blacks seem to get along pretty well”.

    They vote the same way but they rarely hang out together. Perhaps my experience was atypical but here is how I grew up. My parents had lot’s of friends both Jewish and gentile. They got along perfectly fine with gentile whites and thought of them as more similar than not, other than religion. Blacks on the hand were a completely different group they called Schwartzas. The only black I knew was our maid Mary.

    Although I identify more with being non-religious than Jewish I would say 90% of my friends are white non-Jews, partly because I live in an area with few Jews. I get along with gentiles perfectly fine, Some blacks too but I would have nothing in common with the thug types. I am just one individual person but those are my experiences for what their worth.

  232. @Twinkie

    “Restrictionist.” So I guess you don’t think the entire world should come here. Otherwise, that term is useless because it can be applied relatively. 100 million want to come, but I only allowed 10 million to enter. See? I’m a restrictionist!
     
    Don’t be a moron. It’s easy to be an absolutist on the Internet.* The more useful question is determining which side of the fence you want people to be. Broadly, there are three groups of voters and interests: 1) people who like the status quo, 2) people who want to increase immigration, and 3) people who want to reduce immigration.

    Do you want to win or do you want to alienate the bulk of no. 3 with your stupid “they have to all go back” fantasy? You have to first get most voters on the restriction side (and make that a political priority). Once that is achieved, the rest is just negotiating. My personal view is that we should dramatically reduce illegal immigration with very tough enforcement AND also significantly curtail legal immigration. Currently we have had roughly 1 million per year for the past decade. I’d like to see that number drop to at least 100,000 - 200,000 per annum. And I also would like to abolish the H1B visas.

    Would further reductions be desirable? I think they would be, but, frankly, even getting to the above scenario would be a near miracle, so debating about how much more at that point is a waste of time and perhaps even counterproductive.

    *I am a 2nd Amendment absolutist. I want suppressed select-fire weapons for everyone. But I’m not going to waste my breath or keystrokes on that fantasy when there are more dire threats and issues at hand. The left beats us by incrementalism, and we would be wise to learn their methodology.

    Currently we have had roughly 1 million per year for the past decade.

    Akshully, that’s been the case since GHW Bush in 1989, with the only real reductions occurring from about 1993-1995 (that was the period when immigration control became briefly mainstream among both parties) and from 2002-2004 (post 9/11).

    • Replies: @Mark G.
    You could start by eliminating all categories of immigrants who are either likely to commit crimes, go on welfare, or who would vote for candidates who support welfare for recent immigrants. This would probably cut out the majority of third world immigration which is also the majority of the million immigrants coming in every year. You could also ditch the multiculturalist ideology which keeps them from learning the culture and language once they get here. Many natives would probably support this, as polling seems to indicate. You had rapid economic growth in the late nineteenth century with high immigration because they couldn't go on welfare and the melting pot ideology existed then. The ones who couldn't make it here went back home. The other major difference between then and now is we have a larger population and large numbers of immigrants could cause environmental problems now. The right doesn't like to frame high immigration as an environmental issue but if you did then that would broaden the appeal of immigration restriction too.
  233. @dfordoom

    Empire must end so people can’t use it for guilt tripping purposes. Unfortunately, many of the same people (not necessarily here in UNZ) who support closing borders, love them some new aircraft careers to kill Persians.
     
    Agreed. And this doesn't just apply to the U.S. either - the British still haven't accepted that the British Empire is gone which is why they're so anxious to tag along every time the American Empire has a new war to fight. Which makes it easy to argue that if the British end up having their country taken away from them it's just legitimate payback for their imperialism.

    And given just how sleazy and disreputable the history of the British Empire was, anyone making that argument has a point. The British have much to be ashamed of.

    Every empire basically works the same way, although the breadth and longevity may vary. The Anglo countries knew that a common tongue would work in their favor, so they were the quickest to sign up as “allies” (puppets) of the US. As I’ve often said, the three capitals of America’s global empire are Bos-Wash, London, and Tel Aviv.

  234. @Audacious Epigone
    Great point regarding not literally talking about deplorables but clearly taking digs at them again and again and again. And this is only the first debate, with ten people each--the claws will sink in deeper in future debates when the field narrows.

    Bill Clinton was a terrific politician and personality*, Hilary is raw corruption and ambition with no charm at all.

    Today’s leading Dems are better politicians than Hilary (how could they not be?), though I’m not sure how many of them are better people.

    *Bill fought with the sycophants in Hilary’s war room, desperately trying to convey to them that the Rust-Belt was a toss-up region that needed more attention. But Bill was a pragmatist who knew how to read an audience and situation.

  235. @MikeatMikedotMike
    "White Americans continually display higher levels of patriotism than white Europeans, and the guilt tripping is far more intense in Germany, but levels of obesity and drug use are lower."

    I am not an expert on German economics, but are they conducting a job outsourcing campaign similar to what the US has perpetrated upon its working class the last 40 years? Does Germany have 100's of defacto ghost towns littering its equivalent of the Rust Belt and midwest, where manufacturing and industry once thrived? No? What is the size and scope and influence of Germany's pharmaceutical leviathan in comparison to the US's? Does Germany have the world's biggest 3rd world narco state occupying over a 1000 miles of its porous southern boarder? Does Germany have separate graduations for its high school kids in Russian? What does Germany's sugar and farming lobby look like in comparison to the US? Have they had the disastrous "Food Pyramid" seared into their brains the last 60 years? Does Germany have 10's of 1000's of white ME war veterans consuming SSRI's in "treatment" of PSTD? Does Germany have an entire sub-culture of feral negros promoting a glamorous version of ghetto life, marketed directly at a susceptible white youth?

    And finally, probably most importantly, even as of 2017 Germany was still 89% European and 75% ethnic German. No doubt that will change within a couple generations. When the European percentage of the total population of Germany drops to 65%, then let's revisit their drug addiction, obesity, and criminality rates.

    "I wasn’t discussing black dysfunction in lifestyle, I was criticizing a trend of black politics that our people are copying."

    You'd have a point if the entire system wasn't currently designed to prop up negros (to their and everyone else's detriment) in every possibly way. Whites OTOH, have the entire system working against them. In other words, negros actually have nothing to complain about; they're handed everything. Whites are not.

    You can read that last sentence as complaint, but it is pure observation.

    So instead of you and I continuing to go round and round, let me hear your solutions. Lawfare? The courts are against us and the people who appoint judges are against us. Retweets? Account suspended. Raising awareness? Cville outcome. Blank white piece of paper? Racist!

    I am not an expert on German economics, but are they conducting a job outsourcing campaign similar to what the US has perpetrated upon its working class the last 40 years? Does Germany have 100’s of defacto ghost towns littering its equivalent of the Rust Belt and midwest, where manufacturing and industry once thrived? No? What is the size and scope and influence of Germany’s pharmaceutical leviathan in comparison to the US’s? Does Germany have the world’s biggest 3rd world narco state occupying over a 1000 miles of its porous southern boarder? Does Germany have separate graduations for its high school kids in Russian? What does Germany’s sugar and farming lobby look like in comparison to the US? Have they had the disastrous “Food Pyramid” seared into their brains the last 60 years? Does Germany have 10’s of 1000’s of white ME war veterans consuming SSRI’s in “treatment” of PSTD? Does Germany have an entire sub-culture of feral negros promoting a glamorous version of ghetto life, marketed directly at a susceptible white youth?

    Germany is not currently an empire trying to control and occupy virtually the entire world. It’s amazing what a country can accomplish on it’s own soil when it isn’t trying to “export” it’s culture and power across the world.

  236. @Feryl
    I see it in many of the comments here. A large part of the railing against “welfare” (and yes, it is a mess) is because the commenter believes that the recepients get money (sucess) the “wrong” way.

    Since the 70's it's been common to say "I want all the money I can hang onto", because the assumption is that other people are worthless and stupid, and there's no moral imperative to try and extend them a hand, since they chose to have these problems and it's a big waste to try and rescue them.

    That this mentality flies totally in the face of the humane and compassionate culture of the 1930's-1960's (when the mentality was that "we're all on this together" and all for one, one for all) is generally ignored.

    since they chose to have these problems and it’s a big waste to try and rescue them.

    Assignment of responsibility is a big Gordian knot tar baby. A UBI solves many problems and in particular it skips assigning responsibility entirely. Put everyone at the starting line with the same change purse and let the competition and assorting run wild.

    • Replies: @Feryl
    Under an egalitarian dogma, we expect the most talented and disciplined people to settle for less so as to not alienate and further burden the untermensch.

    Under social Darwinism, the various struggles faced by the lower class become a "what me worry" sort of thing, where we passively accept a dysfunctional underclass and all the ugly trappings of such. It's this sour and misanthropic attitude that's mainly responsible for the ever worsening national mood that we've had since the mid-70's.

    And if we had a dollar for everytime someone says "they knew what they were getting into" in the Reaganite era.....According to them, it's "paternalism" for the government to prevent businesses from defrauding people, and for drugs to be controlled, and for gambling to be discouraged, etc.
  237. @SFG
    Occupying the same ecological niche, perhaps? Jews and blacks seem to get along pretty well. Still, in some cases they mesh instead of clashing--there are a lot of (pick 2 of 3) Jewish-Asian-gentile white hybrids floating around the Northeastern upper middle class these days. Not sure why one happens and not the other.

    Didn't AE show Jewish antigentilism was more of an elite phenomenon than a generally distributed one, a while ago?

    Occupying the same ecological niche, perhaps?

    Yeah, something like that. Squirrels resent chipmunks for the same reason bears resent cougars; they both have similar skill sets, territory, and goals, thereby increasing competition.

  238. @iffen
    since they chose to have these problems and it’s a big waste to try and rescue them.

    Assignment of responsibility is a big Gordian knot tar baby. A UBI solves many problems and in particular it skips assigning responsibility entirely. Put everyone at the starting line with the same change purse and let the competition and assorting run wild.

    Under an egalitarian dogma, we expect the most talented and disciplined people to settle for less so as to not alienate and further burden the untermensch.

    Under social Darwinism, the various struggles faced by the lower class become a “what me worry” sort of thing, where we passively accept a dysfunctional underclass and all the ugly trappings of such. It’s this sour and misanthropic attitude that’s mainly responsible for the ever worsening national mood that we’ve had since the mid-70’s.

    And if we had a dollar for everytime someone says “they knew what they were getting into” in the Reaganite era…..According to them, it’s “paternalism” for the government to prevent businesses from defrauding people, and for drugs to be controlled, and for gambling to be discouraged, etc.

    • Replies: @iffen
    we expect the most talented and disciplined people to settle for less so as to not alienate and further burden the untermensch.

    This is some sort of fantasy ideal.Where and when did this happen?

    BTW, I have a squirrel and chimpmunk problem and they are both doing great.
  239. @Feryl

    Currently we have had roughly 1 million per year for the past decade.
     
    Akshully, that's been the case since GHW Bush in 1989, with the only real reductions occurring from about 1993-1995 (that was the period when immigration control became briefly mainstream among both parties) and from 2002-2004 (post 9/11).

    You could start by eliminating all categories of immigrants who are either likely to commit crimes, go on welfare, or who would vote for candidates who support welfare for recent immigrants. This would probably cut out the majority of third world immigration which is also the majority of the million immigrants coming in every year. You could also ditch the multiculturalist ideology which keeps them from learning the culture and language once they get here. Many natives would probably support this, as polling seems to indicate. You had rapid economic growth in the late nineteenth century with high immigration because they couldn’t go on welfare and the melting pot ideology existed then. The ones who couldn’t make it here went back home. The other major difference between then and now is we have a larger population and large numbers of immigrants could cause environmental problems now. The right doesn’t like to frame high immigration as an environmental issue but if you did then that would broaden the appeal of immigration restriction too.

    • Agree: Mr. Rational
    • Replies: @Mr. Rational

    The right doesn’t like to frame high immigration as an environmental issue but if you did then that would broaden the appeal of immigration restriction too.
     
    ZPG was one of the Sierra Club's original positions.  Nuclear power (as opposed to dams) was another.
    , @Feryl

    You had rapid economic growth in the late nineteenth century with high immigration because they couldn’t go on welfare and the melting pot ideology existed then.
     
    We also had teeming urban areas, and fairly high levels of poverty, and were importing ethnic criminal syndicates. Losts and early GI's, if look back at their recollections of childhood, don't think of it as some idyllic time. Lots of rough places and rough characters. There was also the fear that immigrants were not respecting America's ruling class, and elites across the world trembled after the Russian Revolution. If Americans really thought the late 19th century was so stellar, they would not have shut the borders in the 1920's.

    The ones who couldn’t make it here went back home. The other major difference between then and now is we have a larger population and large numbers of immigrants could cause environmental problems now. The right doesn’t like to frame high immigration as an environmental issue but if you did then that would broaden the appeal of immigration restriction too.
     
    Environmentalism was framed in populist and wholesome terms during the Great Compression (1930-1980), it has since been turned into a farce in the corrupt Neo-lib era; the woke corporate Left has so hi-jacked the issue that many conservatives have lost respect for environmentalism. The prevailing thought on both the Left and Right has to be populist, not elitist and corruption enabling. Then we can frame issues sensibly, because that's what will appeal to people.
    , @dfordoom

    The right doesn’t like to frame high immigration as an environmental issue but if you did then that would broaden the appeal of immigration restriction too.
     
    The right doesn’t like to frame high immigration as an environmental issue because they're afraid it might be effective. And the right wants high immigration to continue.

    The right is terrifed of having the immigration focus moved away from race on to the actual costs of immigration. They're terrified because people might then start looking at the economic costs, people might start noticing that business wants immigration because it keeps wages low.
    , @dfordoom

    You had rapid economic growth in the late nineteenth century with high immigration because they couldn’t go on welfare and the melting pot ideology existed then.
     
    No. You had rapid economic growth coupled with high immigration in the late 19th century because you had a rapidly growing manufacturing sector with an insatiable demand for labour. That's a situation that is never going to recur.
  240. @Feryl
    Under an egalitarian dogma, we expect the most talented and disciplined people to settle for less so as to not alienate and further burden the untermensch.

    Under social Darwinism, the various struggles faced by the lower class become a "what me worry" sort of thing, where we passively accept a dysfunctional underclass and all the ugly trappings of such. It's this sour and misanthropic attitude that's mainly responsible for the ever worsening national mood that we've had since the mid-70's.

    And if we had a dollar for everytime someone says "they knew what they were getting into" in the Reaganite era.....According to them, it's "paternalism" for the government to prevent businesses from defrauding people, and for drugs to be controlled, and for gambling to be discouraged, etc.

    we expect the most talented and disciplined people to settle for less so as to not alienate and further burden the untermensch.

    This is some sort of fantasy ideal.Where and when did this happen?

    BTW, I have a squirrel and chimpmunk problem and they are both doing great.

    • Replies: @Feryl
    In a era of low striving for status, we have fewer elites desperately climbing over each other to be in the 1%, which allows them to better take care of everyone else. Why do you think the rich paid more of their income to the government in the 1940's-1970's?

    You can poke holes in the policies of that time period, but overall, it was much better than the neo-liberal era.

    And as I said above, bullying, cheating, corruption, poor manners, and shouting matches have gotten significantly worse since the mid-80's. Why? Too many people too concerned about status, and not concerned enough about doing what's in the society's best long-term interest.

    It gets old hearing people make the facile claim that certain problems have always existed and always will. That's technically true, but it conceals the extent to which we've had problems, and that they rise or fall depending on time and place. Americans use to be thinner, more patient, and more modest. America used to make things.

    https://i2.wp.com/peterturchin.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/saez.jpg?resize=768%2C511

    That's called "settling for less". Elites demonstrated less and less resistance to the idea of spreading the wealth after the Great Depression and continuing through the 1960's. The intellectual foundations of Reaganism were laid in the 1970's, but not until the 80's did it break through.
  241. @Mark G.
    You could start by eliminating all categories of immigrants who are either likely to commit crimes, go on welfare, or who would vote for candidates who support welfare for recent immigrants. This would probably cut out the majority of third world immigration which is also the majority of the million immigrants coming in every year. You could also ditch the multiculturalist ideology which keeps them from learning the culture and language once they get here. Many natives would probably support this, as polling seems to indicate. You had rapid economic growth in the late nineteenth century with high immigration because they couldn't go on welfare and the melting pot ideology existed then. The ones who couldn't make it here went back home. The other major difference between then and now is we have a larger population and large numbers of immigrants could cause environmental problems now. The right doesn't like to frame high immigration as an environmental issue but if you did then that would broaden the appeal of immigration restriction too.

    The right doesn’t like to frame high immigration as an environmental issue but if you did then that would broaden the appeal of immigration restriction too.

    ZPG was one of the Sierra Club’s original positions.  Nuclear power (as opposed to dams) was another.

    • Replies: @Feryl
    The Left remained quite ornery into the early 90's (including the Sierra Club, who didn't buckle on immigration until the mid 90's); not until the late 90's did aggressive (real) Leftism die off. Everybody sold out in the late 90's.

    The Right was actively cucking in the 70's, which the Left resisted to some degree for a while. During most of the New Deal era, the Right begrudgingly accept pro-labor and pro-lower class legislation, but once many people started to turn on the New Deal in the 70's, the Right started to posture that they were "rugged rebels" and lovers of freedom who could be trusted to dismantle every last remnant of FDR's America.
  242. Every single D.N.C. candidate is a total stooge for our “lie us into endless illegal war “establishment oligarchs”

    …our wonderful ..”22.3 Trillion national debt”….”war is good” ….Neocon oligarchs .

    There is one exception…. to them ALL..

    Tulsi Gabbard.

    She is The Iraq war vet / tell the truth/ lets bring peace on earth/surfer dude …who is going to ride her ‘Peace and Aloha” Tsunami …right into the White House !

    She is just too cool for words !

    God bless her….may she win………. by a landslide !

    and shame on all the other ..”.disgraceful” DNC puppets,… for being total sellouts ..to Neocon perpetual war, …mass murder …. and heinous debt.

    • Replies: @Talha

    Tulsi Gabbard.
     
    No please - no more "successful" women who never had kids leading Western nations. Please, for the love of God - do not put them up front and center as examples of success!

    Peace.
  243. @alexander
    Every single D.N.C. candidate is a total stooge for our "lie us into endless illegal war "establishment oligarchs"

    ...our wonderful .."22.3 Trillion national debt"...."war is good" ....Neocon oligarchs .

    There is one exception.... to them ALL..

    Tulsi Gabbard.

    She is The Iraq war vet / tell the truth/ lets bring peace on earth/surfer dude ...who is going to ride her 'Peace and Aloha" Tsunami ...right into the White House !

    She is just too cool for words !

    God bless her....may she win.......... by a landslide !

    and shame on all the other ..".disgraceful" DNC puppets,... for being total sellouts ..to Neocon perpetual war, ...mass murder .... and heinous debt.

    Tulsi Gabbard.

    No please – no more “successful” women who never had kids leading Western nations. Please, for the love of God – do not put them up front and center as examples of success!

    Peace.

    • Agree: iffen
    • Replies: @alexander
    Talha,

    Don't be such an Anti -woman" jihadi"....Tulsi is just too cool...She has hit the "bulls eye" on every single issue that matters to the American people.

    Who knows....She might turn out to be the greatest President in American History.
  244. @Feryl
    Could someone please explain to me what it is about SW Asians that entitles them to inherit the mantle of Progressive thought? The whole thing smacks of opportunism and shamelessness, moreover the globalists who run mainstream Western news certainly like to think of SW Asians as being soldiers of corporate approved wokeness in good standing. Hispanics are too languid, East Asians are too peaceful and timid, and blacks are too unruly (and liable to dis and attack their one time allies).

    The answer to the question is contained within it. They know how to play the game exceptionally well. They were oppressors where they come from because that’s the way to the top on the subcontinent, and they’re oppressed here because that’s the way to the top in the Western world.

    • Replies: @Feryl
    The real question is why any country in their right mind wants anything to with the cut-throat and fractious cultures of Africa, The Middle East, and Western Asia. European and epicanthic fold Asians (with most US "Hispanics" being, to varying degrees, European and New World Indian) being more pro-social and having less ethnic or class baggage.

    With all due respect, I think at this point it's clear exactly what level of high and peaceful civilization each ethnic group can maintain:

    1) Generally high functioning and inclined to civility: Europeans (including "white Hispanics") and epicanthic fold Asians

    2)Moderate functioning but often ill-tempered and chaotic: Middle Easterners/North Africans, Western Asians, less European "Hispanics"

    3)Low functioning and quite dangerous: Most tropical Island peoples/equatorial jungle peoples with no East Asian DNA, SS Africans.

    Europe and East Asia have produced the most consistently unified and strong societies, other ethnic groups have their moments but generally can't sustain too much for too long.
    , @iffen
    They were oppressors where they come from because that’s the way to the top on the

    Most of them were part of the "oppression." Staying on top is different from finding a way to the top. Most do have not empathy for their lower classes there and have little empathy for other classes when they get here.

  245. @Feryl
    Some research found that "straight" acting gays tend to have better outcomes in life than the most flaming ones. It could be that "straight" gays are better at "passing", and are treated with more respect, which gives them confidence and they are better able to avoid the nihilist zombie mentality that some gays have.

    Alternatively, could it simply be that the ones who aren’t narcisstically flamboyant also have better mental health in general?

    • Replies: @Feryl
    One explanation is that more masculine gays are better developed/more mature, which would also fit with the idea that shorter and uglier men are more likely to be sociopaths and criminals* (some study found that the more attractive someone is, the less likely they are to be criminals; if you look at real life prison yards, you do seem to see a lot of ugly people).

    Far from "Hannibal Lectors" being commonplace, in reality "bad actors" are often stupid, immature, and unattractive.

    *There's a possibility of socialization here; well-built and attractive males feel better and more confident, while smaller and uglier guys end up feeling bitter and resentful, which fuels a vindictive sentiment.
  246. @Talha

    Tulsi Gabbard.
     
    No please - no more "successful" women who never had kids leading Western nations. Please, for the love of God - do not put them up front and center as examples of success!

    Peace.

    Talha,

    Don’t be such an Anti -woman” jihadi”….Tulsi is just too cool…She has hit the “bulls eye” on every single issue that matters to the American people.

    Who knows….She might turn out to be the greatest President in American History.

    • Replies: @Talha
    That’s the thing - don’t make being childless “cool” for women. If it was some dried up old coot, that would actually be better. You need young women to want to be mothers right now in the West. It is far more important than who wins this or that election!

    Peace.
    , @iffen
    She has hit the “bulls eye” on every single issue that matters to the American people.

    Yeah, like visiting immigration centers and pushing for more immigration.

    The main reason Tulsi gets support here is because some think she will denounce and cut ties with Israel and that appeals to many of the commenters at Unz. Talha has a tinge of anti-Semitism, but it is principled.
  247. @iffen
    we expect the most talented and disciplined people to settle for less so as to not alienate and further burden the untermensch.

    This is some sort of fantasy ideal.Where and when did this happen?

    BTW, I have a squirrel and chimpmunk problem and they are both doing great.

    In a era of low striving for status, we have fewer elites desperately climbing over each other to be in the 1%, which allows them to better take care of everyone else. Why do you think the rich paid more of their income to the government in the 1940’s-1970’s?

    You can poke holes in the policies of that time period, but overall, it was much better than the neo-liberal era.

    And as I said above, bullying, cheating, corruption, poor manners, and shouting matches have gotten significantly worse since the mid-80’s. Why? Too many people too concerned about status, and not concerned enough about doing what’s in the society’s best long-term interest.

    It gets old hearing people make the facile claim that certain problems have always existed and always will. That’s technically true, but it conceals the extent to which we’ve had problems, and that they rise or fall depending on time and place. Americans use to be thinner, more patient, and more modest. America used to make things.

    https://i2.wp.com/peterturchin.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/saez.jpg?resize=768%2C511

    That’s called “settling for less”. Elites demonstrated less and less resistance to the idea of spreading the wealth after the Great Depression and continuing through the 1960’s. The intellectual foundations of Reaganism were laid in the 1970’s, but not until the 80’s did it break through.

  248. @Mr. Rational

    The right doesn’t like to frame high immigration as an environmental issue but if you did then that would broaden the appeal of immigration restriction too.
     
    ZPG was one of the Sierra Club's original positions.  Nuclear power (as opposed to dams) was another.

    The Left remained quite ornery into the early 90’s (including the Sierra Club, who didn’t buckle on immigration until the mid 90’s); not until the late 90’s did aggressive (real) Leftism die off. Everybody sold out in the late 90’s.

    The Right was actively cucking in the 70’s, which the Left resisted to some degree for a while. During most of the New Deal era, the Right begrudgingly accept pro-labor and pro-lower class legislation, but once many people started to turn on the New Deal in the 70’s, the Right started to posture that they were “rugged rebels” and lovers of freedom who could be trusted to dismantle every last remnant of FDR’s America.

  249. @Audacious Epigone
    Alternatively, could it simply be that the ones who aren't narcisstically flamboyant also have better mental health in general?

    One explanation is that more masculine gays are better developed/more mature, which would also fit with the idea that shorter and uglier men are more likely to be sociopaths and criminals* (some study found that the more attractive someone is, the less likely they are to be criminals; if you look at real life prison yards, you do seem to see a lot of ugly people).

    Far from “Hannibal Lectors” being commonplace, in reality “bad actors” are often stupid, immature, and unattractive.

    *There’s a possibility of socialization here; well-built and attractive males feel better and more confident, while smaller and uglier guys end up feeling bitter and resentful, which fuels a vindictive sentiment.

    • Replies: @Audacious Epigone
    The concept of "opportunity cost" alone could go a long way in explaining this.
  250. @alexander
    Talha,

    Don't be such an Anti -woman" jihadi"....Tulsi is just too cool...She has hit the "bulls eye" on every single issue that matters to the American people.

    Who knows....She might turn out to be the greatest President in American History.

    That’s the thing – don’t make being childless “cool” for women. If it was some dried up old coot, that would actually be better. You need young women to want to be mothers right now in the West. It is far more important than who wins this or that election!

    Peace.

  251. @Mark G.
    You could start by eliminating all categories of immigrants who are either likely to commit crimes, go on welfare, or who would vote for candidates who support welfare for recent immigrants. This would probably cut out the majority of third world immigration which is also the majority of the million immigrants coming in every year. You could also ditch the multiculturalist ideology which keeps them from learning the culture and language once they get here. Many natives would probably support this, as polling seems to indicate. You had rapid economic growth in the late nineteenth century with high immigration because they couldn't go on welfare and the melting pot ideology existed then. The ones who couldn't make it here went back home. The other major difference between then and now is we have a larger population and large numbers of immigrants could cause environmental problems now. The right doesn't like to frame high immigration as an environmental issue but if you did then that would broaden the appeal of immigration restriction too.

    You had rapid economic growth in the late nineteenth century with high immigration because they couldn’t go on welfare and the melting pot ideology existed then.

    We also had teeming urban areas, and fairly high levels of poverty, and were importing ethnic criminal syndicates. Losts and early GI’s, if look back at their recollections of childhood, don’t think of it as some idyllic time. Lots of rough places and rough characters. There was also the fear that immigrants were not respecting America’s ruling class, and elites across the world trembled after the Russian Revolution. If Americans really thought the late 19th century was so stellar, they would not have shut the borders in the 1920’s.

    The ones who couldn’t make it here went back home. The other major difference between then and now is we have a larger population and large numbers of immigrants could cause environmental problems now. The right doesn’t like to frame high immigration as an environmental issue but if you did then that would broaden the appeal of immigration restriction too.

    Environmentalism was framed in populist and wholesome terms during the Great Compression (1930-1980), it has since been turned into a farce in the corrupt Neo-lib era; the woke corporate Left has so hi-jacked the issue that many conservatives have lost respect for environmentalism. The prevailing thought on both the Left and Right has to be populist, not elitist and corruption enabling. Then we can frame issues sensibly, because that’s what will appeal to people.

  252. @Feryl

    But the much bigger problem is that there’s a very big chunk of white people who are absolutely delighted with the way things are going. Rich whites are delighted. They’re getting richer. Upper middle-class whites are delighted with the situation. They have enough money to live in nice comfortable safe whitopias, and they’re making lots of money.
     
    '

    I don't think anyone is that happy right now (according to Peter Turchin, Americans felt better as time went on from 1900-1960, and have been feeling more and more discouraged since 1961). Rather, I think that what the upper classes perceive to be both the problem and the solution are vastly different from what lower class native born people think. For example, most "true" elites (as defined by lots of education and paying tons of money to live in a fashionable area) these days aren't embarrassed to blow tons of cash on status items; back in the New Deal era, this sort of consumption was considered very shameful, because it was understood that it could stir discontent among the lower class (who might feel as if the money being squandered ought to go toward more pro-social things like higher wages). Elites for the last 40 years have largely agreed that it's ok to slash taxes on rich people, and plow tons of money into the stock market/real estate* and conspicuous consumption, rather than the Keynesian/New Deal approach of having elites shoulder more of the tax burden, while they devote their earnings toward investment in things like manufacturing capacity, infrastructure, and better treatment of workers.

    *America is more expensive than ever to live in, in large part due to fiscal policies (debt-based economy) that encourage irresponsible (but elite friendly) cost inflation of stuff like rent, property, medical bills, and education costs. No healthy, viable in the long-term economy should be based on elites profiteering from expenses that have been jacked up so high that vast numbers of mid-lower class American must resort to indebting themselves to get by.

    https://pixel.nymag.com/imgs/daily/intelligencer/2017/12/14/14-inequality-1.nocrop.w710.h2147483647.png

    Every econ. "boom" since the mid-80's keeps going to a smaller and smaller share of the population. That's because wages are stagnant, and living expenses keep going up; few people have investments in the real estate market and stock market, but those who do have been flying high since 1984.

    White Christians are overjoyed by the current situation – so many opportunities for virtue-signalling! Whites who run small businesses are very pleased – they’re getting cheap labour. White male homosexuals are delighted – lots of immigrants to exploit sexually. White college students think everything is great because being an SJW is so much fun – much more fun than actually doing your coursework. White bureaucrats are happy – never have so many bureaucrats been needed!
     
    It took a while, but Xtiandom is basically dying off, relative to what it was in the 90's (or prior decades). Europeans lost interest in the mid-20th century, and North Americans have lost interest in the early 21st century.

    Most gays are apathetic toward politics. Today's college students are about the most miserable class of people you could imagine, as stress and anxiety have been recorded at very high levels. Living in a Gilded Age really is just not much fun for anyone; lower class people just scrape by (if they manage to stay off the street or out of prison), while upper class people are constantly arguing, back stabbing, and nervous that they could be knocked off their perch by fellow elites or populist revolutionaries.

    while upper class people are constantly arguing, back stabbing, and nervous that they could be knocked off their perch by fellow elites or populist revolutionaries.

    I hadn’t heard that there was an epidemic of depression among billionaires. Most billionaires today look pretty damned happy to me. And they look hyper-confident.

    • Replies: @Feryl
    Forget the billionaires, look at the people frequently in the orbit of billionaires (like higher level lawyers, and mainstream journalists/TV presenters). They're mostly pretty glum these days, except some moments of sardonic humor. I dunno what your age is, but back in the Great Compression (1930-1980), there was rising willingness of people to laugh, smile, and be friendly, though it stagnated a bit after Watergate/Kent State et al.

    WRT hysteria about being in a "dangerous" society, Jon Haidt has pointed out that elites have always been at the forefront of hyper-alarmist parenting styles since the beginning of the neo-lib era in the 80's. That's a huge contrast from the Great Compression, when most people left their kids alone to do whatever it is that kid's naturally want to do.

    Plus, there's the super-duper competitive attitude most people have these days, certainly the elites. I recently saw on Sailer's blog that there have been some cases of Wall Streeters grinding away for so long that they neglect sleep and become mentally imbalanced, ending up committing suicide or dying from complete exhaustion. People are not psychologically healthy right now. There's a reason that Boomers are always complaining that society isn't like how it used to be. When they were kids, we didn't have this workaholism, or this mania for competition, or this insecurity that someone out there has more than I do.
  253. @Audacious Epigone
    The answer to the question is contained within it. They know how to play the game exceptionally well. They were oppressors where they come from because that's the way to the top on the subcontinent, and they're oppressed here because that's the way to the top in the Western world.

    The real question is why any country in their right mind wants anything to with the cut-throat and fractious cultures of Africa, The Middle East, and Western Asia. European and epicanthic fold Asians (with most US “Hispanics” being, to varying degrees, European and New World Indian) being more pro-social and having less ethnic or class baggage.

    With all due respect, I think at this point it’s clear exactly what level of high and peaceful civilization each ethnic group can maintain:

    1) Generally high functioning and inclined to civility: Europeans (including “white Hispanics”) and epicanthic fold Asians

    2)Moderate functioning but often ill-tempered and chaotic: Middle Easterners/North Africans, Western Asians, less European “Hispanics”

    3)Low functioning and quite dangerous: Most tropical Island peoples/equatorial jungle peoples with no East Asian DNA, SS Africans.

    Europe and East Asia have produced the most consistently unified and strong societies, other ethnic groups have their moments but generally can’t sustain too much for too long.

  254. @dfordoom

    while upper class people are constantly arguing, back stabbing, and nervous that they could be knocked off their perch by fellow elites or populist revolutionaries.
     
    I hadn't heard that there was an epidemic of depression among billionaires. Most billionaires today look pretty damned happy to me. And they look hyper-confident.

    Forget the billionaires, look at the people frequently in the orbit of billionaires (like higher level lawyers, and mainstream journalists/TV presenters). They’re mostly pretty glum these days, except some moments of sardonic humor. I dunno what your age is, but back in the Great Compression (1930-1980), there was rising willingness of people to laugh, smile, and be friendly, though it stagnated a bit after Watergate/Kent State et al.

    WRT hysteria about being in a “dangerous” society, Jon Haidt has pointed out that elites have always been at the forefront of hyper-alarmist parenting styles since the beginning of the neo-lib era in the 80’s. That’s a huge contrast from the Great Compression, when most people left their kids alone to do whatever it is that kid’s naturally want to do.

    Plus, there’s the super-duper competitive attitude most people have these days, certainly the elites. I recently saw on Sailer’s blog that there have been some cases of Wall Streeters grinding away for so long that they neglect sleep and become mentally imbalanced, ending up committing suicide or dying from complete exhaustion. People are not psychologically healthy right now. There’s a reason that Boomers are always complaining that society isn’t like how it used to be. When they were kids, we didn’t have this workaholism, or this mania for competition, or this insecurity that someone out there has more than I do.

  255. @iffen
    counterculture got steered away from wicked anti-capitalist thoughts into nice safe identity politics thoughts

    I agree with much of your comment, but I object to using steered as an explanation. I have a lot of trouble understanding the mechanics of cultural change, but I am certain that steered is an incorrect description.

    counterculture got steered away from wicked anti-capitalist thoughts into nice safe identity politics thoughts

    I agree with much of your comment, but I object to using steered as an explanation. I have a lot of trouble understanding the mechanics of cultural change, but I am certain that steered is an incorrect description.

    I’m not absolutely certain of the mechanisms either. And I’m not sure exactly why the counterculture fell in love with capitalism.

    But I do think there has been some steering going on. If you take the example of Australia, suddenly in the 80s the Australian Labor Party was getting massive support from the corporate sector. And this was at the precise moment that Labor suddenly decided to abandon socialism and begin pursuing right-wing pro-capitalist policies.

    It was about the same time that environmental groups suddenly started to be swimming in corporate money. And lots of corporate money was going into universities.

    Maybe steering is the wrong word. Maybe bribing would be more accurate.

    But I agree that the mechanisms of cultural change are murky. Maybe there were some genuine conversion experiences. Maybe there were fat cigar-chomping capitalists meeting in darkened room and plotting to buy the Left. Maybe it was a bit of both.

    • Replies: @Justvisiting
    The Deep State/Intelligence agencies targeted the left beginning in the 1950s. They used infiltration of the groups, infiltration of the media (opinion leaders), and bribes when necessary.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COINTELPRO

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Mockingbird

    These illegal operations expanded (and then went deep underground when disclosed) and have become institutionalized today.

    They have become standard operating procedure for all Western "democracies" and are more effective with advanced information gathering techniques (such as those disclosed by Snowden and others).

    They have successfully "steered" leftist organizations in whatever direction they choose, for whatever reason they choose.
  256. @iffen
    The entire Left as it had historically existed, based on a critical view of capitalism, simply vanished and was replaced by a new Left that thought capitalism was absolutely awesome. It was one of the most significant political revolutions in history and nobody noticed.

    How did they switch from anti-war to massive support for endles wars?

    Which, by the way, is another reason the elites don't need the working class anymore. They used to have to work at national unity and gaining support for military actions. They don't even have to lift a finger in that direction anymore.

    The entire Left as it had historically existed, based on a critical view of capitalism, simply vanished and was replaced by a new Left that thought capitalism was absolutely awesome. It was one of the most significant political revolutions in history and nobody noticed.

    How did they switch from anti-war to massive support for endles wars?

    Vietnam was unusual in being an unpopular war with liberals. Liberals were very very enthusiastic about WW2. Leftists and liberals always liked the idea of imposing their ideology on other countries at the point of a gun.

    There was one reason and one reason only for the antiwar movement of the 60s. Middle-class college kids feared that they personally might be asked to fight in Vietnam. They would have been absolutely cool with the war had it been fought by a volunteer army, in other words by the poor.

    If you look at the U.S., the Democrats were responsible for getting the U.S. into both world wars plus Korea plus Vietnam. In the postwar period the Administrations that were keen to avoid war were the Eisenhower and Nixon Administrations which inherited wars and brought them to an end. So the really puzzling change was the sudden enthusiasm for war among Republicans. That seemed to start with Reagan. Which was about the time that Republicans ceased to be conservative and became liberals ands neocons.

    That was a definite ideological change, from a conservative scepticism about the wisdom of foreign wars to a rabid enthusiasm for using war to promote liberalism globally.

    • Replies: @iffen
    But, but, the Old Ranger seemed so affable.
  257. @Feryl
    An ideological cycle lasts about 50 years*, so people were going to blow all kinds of smoke in the 80's to try and undermine the New Deal consensus of the 1930's-1970's. Anytime someone tried to defend the New Deal era, they were called a spoil sport, a latent Marxist, and an opponent of "hard work" (because hard work was allegedly discouraged by New Dealism). Besides, New Deal era America was given to Boomers, not created by them, and as such, rising Boomers were going to create something different; I think most people tacitly understood that it wouldn't necessarily be better, but at least it was different. @akinokure.blogspot.com, there's a great article about the Reagan era being fundamentally experimental, since we were blowing up everything that was proven to be of use in the Progressive and New Deal era.

    *The last decade of ideological era will feature extensive criticism of society, which will then give us a subsequent decade where things are done differently. E.g., people began to question the FDR New Deal around 1970, then replaced it in 1980 with Reaganite neo-liberalism. People began to question Social Darwinism around 1920, and replaced it with New Dealism in 1930. People began to question neo-liberalism around 2010, and ideally we will be well on our way to replacing it by 2020.

    People began to question neo-liberalism around 2010, and ideally we will be well on our way to replacing it by 2020.

    You must be seeing something that I’m not seeing. I see neo-liberalism grinding its few remaining viable enemies into the dirt. You see neo-liberalism on the point of collapse. Curious.

    • Agree: Audacious Epigone
  258. @Mark G.
    You could start by eliminating all categories of immigrants who are either likely to commit crimes, go on welfare, or who would vote for candidates who support welfare for recent immigrants. This would probably cut out the majority of third world immigration which is also the majority of the million immigrants coming in every year. You could also ditch the multiculturalist ideology which keeps them from learning the culture and language once they get here. Many natives would probably support this, as polling seems to indicate. You had rapid economic growth in the late nineteenth century with high immigration because they couldn't go on welfare and the melting pot ideology existed then. The ones who couldn't make it here went back home. The other major difference between then and now is we have a larger population and large numbers of immigrants could cause environmental problems now. The right doesn't like to frame high immigration as an environmental issue but if you did then that would broaden the appeal of immigration restriction too.

    The right doesn’t like to frame high immigration as an environmental issue but if you did then that would broaden the appeal of immigration restriction too.

    The right doesn’t like to frame high immigration as an environmental issue because they’re afraid it might be effective. And the right wants high immigration to continue.

    The right is terrifed of having the immigration focus moved away from race on to the actual costs of immigration. They’re terrified because people might then start looking at the economic costs, people might start noticing that business wants immigration because it keeps wages low.

  259. @Mark G.
    You could start by eliminating all categories of immigrants who are either likely to commit crimes, go on welfare, or who would vote for candidates who support welfare for recent immigrants. This would probably cut out the majority of third world immigration which is also the majority of the million immigrants coming in every year. You could also ditch the multiculturalist ideology which keeps them from learning the culture and language once they get here. Many natives would probably support this, as polling seems to indicate. You had rapid economic growth in the late nineteenth century with high immigration because they couldn't go on welfare and the melting pot ideology existed then. The ones who couldn't make it here went back home. The other major difference between then and now is we have a larger population and large numbers of immigrants could cause environmental problems now. The right doesn't like to frame high immigration as an environmental issue but if you did then that would broaden the appeal of immigration restriction too.

    You had rapid economic growth in the late nineteenth century with high immigration because they couldn’t go on welfare and the melting pot ideology existed then.

    No. You had rapid economic growth coupled with high immigration in the late 19th century because you had a rapidly growing manufacturing sector with an insatiable demand for labour. That’s a situation that is never going to recur.

    • Replies: @Mr. Rational

    That’s a situation that is never going to recur.
     
    Absent the Butlerian Jihad or reincarnation of Ned Ludd, automation is going to take out at least 30% and possibly 50% of all current jobs in the next 20 years, if not 15 or 10.

    The last thing the USA needs is immigrants of ANY kind except those qualifying for O-1 visas.
  260. @Audacious Epigone
    The answer to the question is contained within it. They know how to play the game exceptionally well. They were oppressors where they come from because that's the way to the top on the subcontinent, and they're oppressed here because that's the way to the top in the Western world.

    They were oppressors where they come from because that’s the way to the top on the

    Most of them were part of the “oppression.” Staying on top is different from finding a way to the top. Most do have not empathy for their lower classes there and have little empathy for other classes when they get here.

  261. @alexander
    Talha,

    Don't be such an Anti -woman" jihadi"....Tulsi is just too cool...She has hit the "bulls eye" on every single issue that matters to the American people.

    Who knows....She might turn out to be the greatest President in American History.

    She has hit the “bulls eye” on every single issue that matters to the American people.

    Yeah, like visiting immigration centers and pushing for more immigration.

    The main reason Tulsi gets support here is because some think she will denounce and cut ties with Israel and that appeals to many of the commenters at Unz. Talha has a tinge of anti-Semitism, but it is principled.

    • Replies: @alexander
    What I would love to see happen for Israel is for Israel to finally be at Peace with all its neighbors.Not just peace...but good , warm relations with each and everyone of them.

    I would love to see that for Israel.

    I think this would be fantastic.

    Half the world over there hates Israel so much,...I don't like it.

    They have no idea how warm, courteous, and kind most Israelis are..they have no clue.

    Everything is perceived through the prism of war , and endless conflict.

    I don't like it.

    I think Israel should do whatever it can to try and make the Palestinians happy, to show the Palestinians their kind side, not just their hard side.

    I think the Palestinians should accept Israel, and welcome Israel as its brother and work with the Israelis to build a better world..

    Together they could produce a miracle....a new Jerusalem..

    I hope for it .

    I pray for it .

    Every single day.
    , @Talha
    Totally not anti-Semetic. I have Semetic (Arab) origins winding through Persia and then into India. Also, I have met Muslim converts from Jewish background that I am proud to call “brother”.

    Though if not liking Israel is anti-Semetic, sign me up homie!!!

    Peace.
  262. @dfordoom


    The entire Left as it had historically existed, based on a critical view of capitalism, simply vanished and was replaced by a new Left that thought capitalism was absolutely awesome. It was one of the most significant political revolutions in history and nobody noticed.
     
    How did they switch from anti-war to massive support for endles wars?
     
    Vietnam was unusual in being an unpopular war with liberals. Liberals were very very enthusiastic about WW2. Leftists and liberals always liked the idea of imposing their ideology on other countries at the point of a gun.

    There was one reason and one reason only for the antiwar movement of the 60s. Middle-class college kids feared that they personally might be asked to fight in Vietnam. They would have been absolutely cool with the war had it been fought by a volunteer army, in other words by the poor.

    If you look at the U.S., the Democrats were responsible for getting the U.S. into both world wars plus Korea plus Vietnam. In the postwar period the Administrations that were keen to avoid war were the Eisenhower and Nixon Administrations which inherited wars and brought them to an end. So the really puzzling change was the sudden enthusiasm for war among Republicans. That seemed to start with Reagan. Which was about the time that Republicans ceased to be conservative and became liberals ands neocons.

    That was a definite ideological change, from a conservative scepticism about the wisdom of foreign wars to a rabid enthusiasm for using war to promote liberalism globally.

    But, but, the Old Ranger seemed so affable.

  263. @iffen
    She has hit the “bulls eye” on every single issue that matters to the American people.

    Yeah, like visiting immigration centers and pushing for more immigration.

    The main reason Tulsi gets support here is because some think she will denounce and cut ties with Israel and that appeals to many of the commenters at Unz. Talha has a tinge of anti-Semitism, but it is principled.

    What I would love to see happen for Israel is for Israel to finally be at Peace with all its neighbors.Not just peace…but good , warm relations with each and everyone of them.

    I would love to see that for Israel.

    I think this would be fantastic.

    Half the world over there hates Israel so much,…I don’t like it.

    They have no idea how warm, courteous, and kind most Israelis are..they have no clue.

    Everything is perceived through the prism of war , and endless conflict.

    I don’t like it.

    I think Israel should do whatever it can to try and make the Palestinians happy, to show the Palestinians their kind side, not just their hard side.

    I think the Palestinians should accept Israel, and welcome Israel as its brother and work with the Israelis to build a better world..

    Together they could produce a miracle….a new Jerusalem..

    I hope for it .

    I pray for it .

    Every single day.

    • Replies: @iffen
    Peace On Earth, Good Will Toward Men.

    Fill up the glasses barkeep, another round of Kumbaya for all.
    , @alexander
    You know what I would like to see, Iffen.


    Just "one " experiment in "Peace".

    Just ONE!

    That the next time Israel enters Gaza, it is not with tanks, sniper rifles, and percussion grenades....but with hundreds of unarmed Israeli's.... crossing over...with tractors, shovels , hammers and cement mixers.

    And when an Israel carpenter, walking over the rubble, espies a 7 year old Palestinian boy..hiding behind a concrete shard, with fear and trepidation in his eyes....he looks over and says to him.....

    " I am not here to shoot you, young man...I am here to help you..REBUILD !"
    , @Talha
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nU278yFdvgQ

    Peace.
  264. @alexander
    What I would love to see happen for Israel is for Israel to finally be at Peace with all its neighbors.Not just peace...but good , warm relations with each and everyone of them.

    I would love to see that for Israel.

    I think this would be fantastic.

    Half the world over there hates Israel so much,...I don't like it.

    They have no idea how warm, courteous, and kind most Israelis are..they have no clue.

    Everything is perceived through the prism of war , and endless conflict.

    I don't like it.

    I think Israel should do whatever it can to try and make the Palestinians happy, to show the Palestinians their kind side, not just their hard side.

    I think the Palestinians should accept Israel, and welcome Israel as its brother and work with the Israelis to build a better world..

    Together they could produce a miracle....a new Jerusalem..

    I hope for it .

    I pray for it .

    Every single day.

    Peace On Earth, Good Will Toward Men.

    Fill up the glasses barkeep, another round of Kumbaya for all.

  265. @dfordoom


    counterculture got steered away from wicked anti-capitalist thoughts into nice safe identity politics thoughts
     
    I agree with much of your comment, but I object to using steered as an explanation. I have a lot of trouble understanding the mechanics of cultural change, but I am certain that steered is an incorrect description.
     
    I'm not absolutely certain of the mechanisms either. And I'm not sure exactly why the counterculture fell in love with capitalism.

    But I do think there has been some steering going on. If you take the example of Australia, suddenly in the 80s the Australian Labor Party was getting massive support from the corporate sector. And this was at the precise moment that Labor suddenly decided to abandon socialism and begin pursuing right-wing pro-capitalist policies.

    It was about the same time that environmental groups suddenly started to be swimming in corporate money. And lots of corporate money was going into universities.

    Maybe steering is the wrong word. Maybe bribing would be more accurate.

    But I agree that the mechanisms of cultural change are murky. Maybe there were some genuine conversion experiences. Maybe there were fat cigar-chomping capitalists meeting in darkened room and plotting to buy the Left. Maybe it was a bit of both.

    The Deep State/Intelligence agencies targeted the left beginning in the 1950s. They used infiltration of the groups, infiltration of the media (opinion leaders), and bribes when necessary.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COINTELPRO

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Mockingbird

    These illegal operations expanded (and then went deep underground when disclosed) and have become institutionalized today.

    They have become standard operating procedure for all Western “democracies” and are more effective with advanced information gathering techniques (such as those disclosed by Snowden and others).

    They have successfully “steered” leftist organizations in whatever direction they choose, for whatever reason they choose.

    • Replies: @dfordoom

    The Deep State/Intelligence agencies targeted the left beginning in the 1950s. They used infiltration of the groups, infiltration of the media (opinion leaders), and bribes when necessary.
     

    They have successfully “steered” leftist organizations in whatever direction they choose, for whatever reason they choose.
     
    I'm not normally into conspiracy theories but this one has a certain plausibility. It's perfectly plausible that the intelligence agencies would want to do this, and it would explain the otherwise inexplicable mystery of the transformation of the Left into cheerleaders for capitalism. That, and simple straightforward bribery.
  266. @alexander
    What I would love to see happen for Israel is for Israel to finally be at Peace with all its neighbors.Not just peace...but good , warm relations with each and everyone of them.

    I would love to see that for Israel.

    I think this would be fantastic.

    Half the world over there hates Israel so much,...I don't like it.

    They have no idea how warm, courteous, and kind most Israelis are..they have no clue.

    Everything is perceived through the prism of war , and endless conflict.

    I don't like it.

    I think Israel should do whatever it can to try and make the Palestinians happy, to show the Palestinians their kind side, not just their hard side.

    I think the Palestinians should accept Israel, and welcome Israel as its brother and work with the Israelis to build a better world..

    Together they could produce a miracle....a new Jerusalem..

    I hope for it .

    I pray for it .

    Every single day.

    You know what I would like to see, Iffen.

    Just “one ” experiment in “Peace”.

    Just ONE!

    That the next time Israel enters Gaza, it is not with tanks, sniper rifles, and percussion grenades….but with hundreds of unarmed Israeli’s…. crossing over…with tractors, shovels , hammers and cement mixers.

    And when an Israel carpenter, walking over the rubble, espies a 7 year old Palestinian boy..hiding behind a concrete shard, with fear and trepidation in his eyes….he looks over and says to him…..

    ” I am not here to shoot you, young man…I am here to help you..REBUILD !”

    • Replies: @iffen
    I think that you will have to wait for this:

    Isaiah 11:6

    The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them.

    Not to mention this as well:

    Isaiah 2:4

    ... and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more.

    Hope springs eternal.

    You have an inspiring vision; hang with it.

  267. @alexander
    You know what I would like to see, Iffen.


    Just "one " experiment in "Peace".

    Just ONE!

    That the next time Israel enters Gaza, it is not with tanks, sniper rifles, and percussion grenades....but with hundreds of unarmed Israeli's.... crossing over...with tractors, shovels , hammers and cement mixers.

    And when an Israel carpenter, walking over the rubble, espies a 7 year old Palestinian boy..hiding behind a concrete shard, with fear and trepidation in his eyes....he looks over and says to him.....

    " I am not here to shoot you, young man...I am here to help you..REBUILD !"

    I think that you will have to wait for this:

    Isaiah 11:6

    The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them.

    Not to mention this as well:

    Isaiah 2:4

    … and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more.

    Hope springs eternal.

    You have an inspiring vision; hang with it.

  268. @Talha
    What the hell is this crap?!
    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D-hPaSRVAAARaI_.jpg

    Peace.
  269. @dfordoom

    You had rapid economic growth in the late nineteenth century with high immigration because they couldn’t go on welfare and the melting pot ideology existed then.
     
    No. You had rapid economic growth coupled with high immigration in the late 19th century because you had a rapidly growing manufacturing sector with an insatiable demand for labour. That's a situation that is never going to recur.

    That’s a situation that is never going to recur.

    Absent the Butlerian Jihad or reincarnation of Ned Ludd, automation is going to take out at least 30% and possibly 50% of all current jobs in the next 20 years, if not 15 or 10.

    The last thing the USA needs is immigrants of ANY kind except those qualifying for O-1 visas.

    • Replies: @dfordoom

    Absent the Butlerian Jihad or reincarnation of Ned Ludd, automation is going to take out at least 30% and possibly 50% of all current jobs in the next 20 years, if not 15 or 10.
     
    Yep. And it's not just jobs like supermarket cashiers and clerical jobs that will go. It will be jobs like pharmacists and general practitioners, and most legal practitioners (those doing the work done by solicitors in Britain and Australia - I'm not sure what the exact American term for them is). Pilots will probably go. Lots of relatively high-status middle-class jobs.

    The last thing the USA needs is immigrants of ANY kind except those qualifying for O-1 visas.
     
    Agreed. No developed country has any economic need for immigrants. For any developed country immigrants are going to be a net economic cost.
  270. @dfordoom

    the idea that Asian men are at white men’s throats is sensationalist, I think.
     
    It comes from thinking that the worlds of college and the media are the whole world. If most Asian college students are SJWs then most Asians must be SJWs. If most Asians in the media are SJWs then most Asians must be SJWs.

    I have no idea what a so-called Arctic Alliance would mean or look like, exactly
     
    The problem with the Arctic Alliance is not that it would be difficult to persuade East Asians to join. The problem is that it would be difficult to persuade white people to join, given that white people don't see themselves as white people. The assumption behind it is that white people are going to adopt racial identity politics. There is no sign whatsoever that that is likely to happen.

    South Africa is the blackest pill here. Overt, explicit anti-white hostility directed against the white minority by the ruling party and… and most whites still don’t think of themselves politically as whites.

  271. Schoolmarm has been kept quite for awhile. Let’s put her back to sleep and keep her that way. No referring to people as a “wastematter subrace” that needs to be “excised”.

  272. @dfordoom

    television is immensely powerful but it can’t hide reality forever if that reality keeps getting worse.
     
    That's just the problem. If you control the media, especially if you control both the traditional media and social media (and Woke Capital does control both), then you can hide reality almost indefinitely.

    But the much bigger problem is that there's a very big chunk of white people who are absolutely delighted with the way things are going. Rich whites are delighted. They're getting richer. Upper middle-class whites are delighted with the situation. They have enough money to live in nice comfortable safe whitopias, and they're making lots of money. White Christians are overjoyed by the current situation - so many opportunities for virtue-signalling! Whites who run small businesses are very pleased - they're getting cheap labour. White male homosexuals are delighted - lots of immigrants to exploit sexually. White college students think everything is great because being an SJW is so much fun - much more fun than actually doing your coursework. White bureaucrats are happy - never have so many bureaucrats been needed!

    None of these white people could care less if in the long term society goes down the toilet. So you don't even need to hide reality from these people. As far as these white people are concerned, as long as only poorer whites are paying the price for gradual social disintegration they just don't care. In fact they're quite pleased to see poor white people suffering.

    This is a depressingly perspicacious comment, thanks.

    • Agree: Talha
  273. @Toronto Russian

    Could someone please explain to me what it is about SW Asians that entitles them to inherit the mantle of Progressive thought?
     
    They're influenced by the ugliness of ultra conservatism back home? This was a successful 2017 movie, apparently based on what's really happening there:

    Keshav (Akshay Kumar) has to marry a black buffalo because his father (Panditji) is a very religious and superstitious priest, and he believes that his son's marriage to a black buffalo will help improve Keshav's fortune.

    Keshav meets Jaya (Bhumi Pednekar), an educated college going girl, falls in love with her and eventually convinces her to marry him. However, Keshav's father is of the view that Keshav's horoscope is such that he can and should only marry a girl who has two thumbs on her left hand. Since Jaya does not fulfill this requirement, Keshav has an artificial thumb made and gives it to Jaya who wears it as a ring on her thumb. Keshav's unsuspecting father agrees to their marriage.
    (...)
    After a futile attempt to convince his sarpanch and villagers to build toilets in the village, Keshav, with the help of Jaya, contacts the concerned regulatory authority and starts the construction of a toilet in his front yard. When the construction is finished, Keshav's father and the sarpanch arrange to demolish the toilet while Keshav is still asleep. But Keshav wakes up before the toilet is completely destroyed and protects it from complete demolition.

    Jaya now files for a divorce in the local court citing the unavailability of a toilet in her husband's house as the primary reason for seeking a divorce. Due to its unique nature, the case gets a lot of media attention. Politicians and the concerned government departments spring into action to hasten the process of constructing toilets in Keshav's village. But Keshav's father remains steadfast on his decision to not have a toilet in his house, until one day, his mother, while going out to defecate, falls on the doorstep, injures her hip and cries vehemently that she can't possibly walk to the fields to defecate, and that she must use the toilet that Keshav constructed in the front yard. After much reluctance, Keshav's father gives in and helps his mother to the toilet. He then realises that a toilet is indeed a critical requirement within a household.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toilet:_Ek_Prem_Katha
     

    This was a movie plot?

    I’ll never be a good cosmopolitan, ever. I just don’t have it in me.

  274. South Africa, like the rest of Africa is a tribal society. There are roughly 11 major tribes there, that have been in a constant state of warfare for over 300 years.

    The two most powerful tribes were also the most vicious, underhanded and muedweois to each other: These are the Angles and the Boers.

    Fairly recently in history, these two South African tribes set aside their historical and cataclysmic animosity for each other, and have attemped to merge into one tribe. That’s fine, yet their internarional marketing ploy has also been to proclaim a Godlike, “untouchable” status, while simultaneously merging rhe other 9 tribes, against there wishes into one tribe as well. This is highly difficult ad the other 9 tribes have different languages, histories, and deep-seeded divisions and distrust.

    In summary, the marketing strategy of the “Boengle” on the world stage is such; if a Xhosha kills a Zulu, which they do, everyday, this is just two brothers in a family disagreement, insignificant. If a Zulu kills a member of the Godlike tribe (the one that owns everything) this is an international incident.”

    In summary, the two richest, strongest tribes have spent centuries exploiting each other, and driving wedges between the other nine tribes, and are now attempting to lump them together in a sloppy, thrown together way, to create sympaty, whist the Boengles still own everything.

    • Replies: @Talha
    Very interesting comment. I like how you put it in context like that; adding two distinct migrant European “tribes” into the mix of an already tribal dynamic. Haven’t heard it framed that way before. Of course there are the Indians and Cape Malays as well.

    Peace.
  275. @Feryl
    One explanation is that more masculine gays are better developed/more mature, which would also fit with the idea that shorter and uglier men are more likely to be sociopaths and criminals* (some study found that the more attractive someone is, the less likely they are to be criminals; if you look at real life prison yards, you do seem to see a lot of ugly people).

    Far from "Hannibal Lectors" being commonplace, in reality "bad actors" are often stupid, immature, and unattractive.

    *There's a possibility of socialization here; well-built and attractive males feel better and more confident, while smaller and uglier guys end up feeling bitter and resentful, which fuels a vindictive sentiment.

    The concept of “opportunity cost” alone could go a long way in explaining this.

  276. @Justvisiting
    The Deep State/Intelligence agencies targeted the left beginning in the 1950s. They used infiltration of the groups, infiltration of the media (opinion leaders), and bribes when necessary.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COINTELPRO

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Mockingbird

    These illegal operations expanded (and then went deep underground when disclosed) and have become institutionalized today.

    They have become standard operating procedure for all Western "democracies" and are more effective with advanced information gathering techniques (such as those disclosed by Snowden and others).

    They have successfully "steered" leftist organizations in whatever direction they choose, for whatever reason they choose.

    The Deep State/Intelligence agencies targeted the left beginning in the 1950s. They used infiltration of the groups, infiltration of the media (opinion leaders), and bribes when necessary.

    They have successfully “steered” leftist organizations in whatever direction they choose, for whatever reason they choose.

    I’m not normally into conspiracy theories but this one has a certain plausibility. It’s perfectly plausible that the intelligence agencies would want to do this, and it would explain the otherwise inexplicable mystery of the transformation of the Left into cheerleaders for capitalism. That, and simple straightforward bribery.

  277. @iffen
    She has hit the “bulls eye” on every single issue that matters to the American people.

    Yeah, like visiting immigration centers and pushing for more immigration.

    The main reason Tulsi gets support here is because some think she will denounce and cut ties with Israel and that appeals to many of the commenters at Unz. Talha has a tinge of anti-Semitism, but it is principled.

    Totally not anti-Semetic. I have Semetic (Arab) origins winding through Persia and then into India. Also, I have met Muslim converts from Jewish background that I am proud to call “brother”.

    Though if not liking Israel is anti-Semetic, sign me up homie!!!

    Peace.

    • Replies: @iffen
    Though if not liking Israel is anti-Semetic, sign me up homie!!!

    Done.
  278. @Mr. Rational

    That’s a situation that is never going to recur.
     
    Absent the Butlerian Jihad or reincarnation of Ned Ludd, automation is going to take out at least 30% and possibly 50% of all current jobs in the next 20 years, if not 15 or 10.

    The last thing the USA needs is immigrants of ANY kind except those qualifying for O-1 visas.

    Absent the Butlerian Jihad or reincarnation of Ned Ludd, automation is going to take out at least 30% and possibly 50% of all current jobs in the next 20 years, if not 15 or 10.

    Yep. And it’s not just jobs like supermarket cashiers and clerical jobs that will go. It will be jobs like pharmacists and general practitioners, and most legal practitioners (those doing the work done by solicitors in Britain and Australia – I’m not sure what the exact American term for them is). Pilots will probably go. Lots of relatively high-status middle-class jobs.

    The last thing the USA needs is immigrants of ANY kind except those qualifying for O-1 visas.

    Agreed. No developed country has any economic need for immigrants. For any developed country immigrants are going to be a net economic cost.

  279. @Truth
    South Africa, like the rest of Africa is a tribal society. There are roughly 11 major tribes there, that have been in a constant state of warfare for over 300 years.

    The two most powerful tribes were also the most vicious, underhanded and muedweois to each other: These are the Angles and the Boers.

    Fairly recently in history, these two South African tribes set aside their historical and cataclysmic animosity for each other, and have attemped to merge into one tribe. That's fine, yet their internarional marketing ploy has also been to proclaim a Godlike, "untouchable" status, while simultaneously merging rhe other 9 tribes, against there wishes into one tribe as well. This is highly difficult ad the other 9 tribes have different languages, histories, and deep-seeded divisions and distrust.

    In summary, the marketing strategy of the "Boengle" on the world stage is such; if a Xhosha kills a Zulu, which they do, everyday, this is just two brothers in a family disagreement, insignificant. If a Zulu kills a member of the Godlike tribe (the one that owns everything) this is an international incident."

    In summary, the two richest, strongest tribes have spent centuries exploiting each other, and driving wedges between the other nine tribes, and are now attempting to lump them together in a sloppy, thrown together way, to create sympaty, whist the Boengles still own everything.

    Very interesting comment. I like how you put it in context like that; adding two distinct migrant European “tribes” into the mix of an already tribal dynamic. Haven’t heard it framed that way before. Of course there are the Indians and Cape Malays as well.

    Peace.

  280. @alexander
    What I would love to see happen for Israel is for Israel to finally be at Peace with all its neighbors.Not just peace...but good , warm relations with each and everyone of them.

    I would love to see that for Israel.

    I think this would be fantastic.

    Half the world over there hates Israel so much,...I don't like it.

    They have no idea how warm, courteous, and kind most Israelis are..they have no clue.

    Everything is perceived through the prism of war , and endless conflict.

    I don't like it.

    I think Israel should do whatever it can to try and make the Palestinians happy, to show the Palestinians their kind side, not just their hard side.

    I think the Palestinians should accept Israel, and welcome Israel as its brother and work with the Israelis to build a better world..

    Together they could produce a miracle....a new Jerusalem..

    I hope for it .

    I pray for it .

    Every single day.

    Peace.